Liberal Minority Government 2021 - ????

[brihard]

From 2021:

‘Political suicide’: Capital gains tax on home sales a risky proposal, experts say​

“With many Canadians having built their wealth (and retirement plans) on realizing the full value of their home, any amendments would have to carefully balance the impact on the housing market and the financial security of Canadians, and apply only on a go-forward basis,” Hogue wrote in the revised note.

Politicians appear to agree. None of the plans put forward by Canada’s main parties suggest lifting the capital gains exemption for principal residences, with the exception of the Liberal party’s proposed anti-flipping tax.

That’s because it would be “political suicide,” said Tim Cestnick, a tax and personal finance expert and CEO of Our Family Office Inc.

“Many Canadians look at their homes as their pension plan,” he said. “If the government were to just change the rules and start taxing gains, that could put a lot of people into a very challenging retirement situation.”

‘Political suicide’: Capital gains tax on home sales a risky proposal, experts say - National | Globalnews.ca

Conservative Leader Erin O'Toole said, ``Canadians are worried (Liberal Leader Justin Trudeau is) going to be taxing their primary home sales.''

globalnews.ca

Yup, exactly this. I know it would be a red line for me personally.

 

[Remius]

One wishes we had a few more characteristics of Plato’s aristocracy where the ruling class would be barred from owning property

 

[Brad Sallows]

One wishes we had a few more characteristics of Plato’s aristocracy where the ruling class would be barred from owning property

Although, sometimes nobles can be an essential source of emergency revenues.

 

[IKnowNothing]

Yup, exactly this. I know it would be a red line for me personally.

On principal, or would it come down to implementation?

 

[brihard]

On principal, or would it come down to implementation?

I don’t understand the question?

 

[IKnowNothing]

I don’t understand the question?

Is your red line
A. any equity tax on principal residences, regardless of form, function, exemptions etc.
B. an assumed "worst case" equity tax on principal residence where the full value change is taxed for all people

 

[Remius]

Although, sometimes nobles can be an essential source of emergency revenues.

True but The Republic does not quite define Plato’s aristocracy in the same way as the actual historical version. Classical aristocracy is a bit different.

 

[Brad Sallows]

I don’t understand the question?

"How far inside the tent will you allow the camel?"

 

[Quirky]

CBC is busy covering the big stuff.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/after-coming-out-as-trans-my-return-to-sex-work-has-been-unexpectedly-rewarding-1.6939996

I see your tranny and raise you a ileostomy bag.

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/nowornever/afraid-to-show-it-off-here-s-how-to-love-the-skin-you-re-in-1.6871278/creating-content-on-onlyfans-helped-me-embrace-my-disability-1.6879081

 

[IKnowNothing]

"How far inside the tent will you allow the camel?"

For those of us with land that barrier has been long breached, so the discussion of thresholds/limits isn't about introduction- it's about movement

 

[suffolkowner]

Any Capital gains on primary residences isnt going to last past the election. It would crush the Liberals election chances whatever they may be, better to put in place in your first year

 

[Brad Sallows]

For those of us with land that barrier has been long breached, so the discussion of thresholds/limits isn't about introduction- it's about movement

I own stuff, too, but the division between my primary residence and other stuff seems pretty clear. How is it "breached" in your province?

 

[Furniture]

From 2021:

‘Political suicide’: Capital gains tax on home sales a risky proposal, experts say​

“With many Canadians having built their wealth (and retirement plans) on realizing the full value of their home, any amendments would have to carefully balance the impact on the housing market and the financial security of Canadians, and apply only on a go-forward basis,” Hogue wrote in the revised note.

Politicians appear to agree. None of the plans put forward by Canada’s main parties suggest lifting the capital gains exemption for principal residences, with the exception of the Liberal party’s proposed anti-flipping tax.

That’s because it would be “political suicide,” said Tim Cestnick, a tax and personal finance expert and CEO of Our Family Office Inc.

“Many Canadians look at their homes as their pension plan,” he said. “If the government were to just change the rules and start taxing gains, that could put a lot of people into a very challenging retirement situation.”

‘Political suicide’: Capital gains tax on home sales a risky proposal, experts say - National | Globalnews.ca

Conservative Leader Erin O'Toole said, ``Canadians are worried (Liberal Leader Justin Trudeau is) going to be taxing their primary home sales.''

globalnews.ca

The article explains exactly why no political party will make any serious move on housing affordability.

“Many Canadians look at their homes as their pension plan,” he said. “If the government were to just change the rules and start taxing gains, that could put a lot of people into a very challenging retirement situation.”

Canadians have made their homes their retirement savings, so anything that lowers the value is bad for people who already own. Not lowering the values is bad for people who don't already own... It also has a fun effect of raising rents, as housing becomes more scarce and the market can charge more, meaning those who don't own are put in a position of not being able to save for retirement or property ownership.

A combination of market forces, and political incentives has likely lead the LPC to realize that they can't act to "fix" housing without committing political suicide. Either they appease the current owners and avoid anything that might slow the housing market, or they alienate the people who can't buy into the market.

 

[IKnowNothing]

I own stuff, too, but the division between my primary residence and other stuff seems pretty clear. How is it "breached" in your province?

Canada wide, land over 1.2 acres is not covered under the PRE

Best example -non-agricultural rural residential properties. The precedent has been set that the PRE can be limited based on interpretation of its objective.

 

[Brad Sallows]

Canada wide, land over 1.2 acres is not covered under the PRE

Best example -non-agricultural rural residential properties. The precedent has been set that the PRE can be limited based on interpretation of its objective.

I suppose someone thought they had to close a potential loophole, but I doubt any severe revenue damage would be caused if large non-agricultural/industrial/commercial residential properties were no longer an exception. Push the camel out.

 

[Brad Sallows]

A combination of market forces, and political incentives has likely lead the LPC to realize that they can't act to "fix" housing without committing political suicide. Either they appease the current owners and avoid anything that might slow the housing market, or they alienate the people who can't buy into the market.

I doubt that slowing the market or even bringing prices to approximate stasis (increasing only at rate of general inflation) would be a problem. Losing asset value would be a problem.

The "market forces" are conceptually simple - supply, demand. Governments create/control all the other forces. Most of what I see from governments tends to depress supply and raise demand. If they're that f*cking dumb, then they're going to go on chasing their tails trying to resolve problems they create/increase. And I'll reserve that example of collective stupidity as evidence that they might be that stupid across the board.

 

[Furniture]

I doubt that slowing the market or even bringing prices to approximate stasis (increasing only at rate of general inflation) would be a problem. Losing asset value would be a problem.

The problem with prices staying where they are is simple, if you don't already have property to use as equity or money from the sale of a property, you are unlikely to ever save enough for a down payment to get into the market. It will lock-in the current housing problem many people face.

The "market forces" are conceptually simple - supply, demand. Governments create/control all the other forces. Most of what I see from governments tends to depress supply and raise demand. If they're that f*cking dumb, then they're going to go on chasing their tails trying to resolve problems they create/increase. And I'll reserve that example of collective stupidity as evidence that they might be that stupid across the board.

Which leads us to the current issues... Property values are high, so Canadians view them as a retirement savings.

Governments taking any actions to lower property values, or cool the market are going to face a massive backlash from owners who will see their "retirement savings" dwindle. Governments not doing anything will lead to an ever growing underclass of people who can't afford property, and the "Canadian dream" they want, so they will demand change.

The LPC is trying to figure out how to appease both groups, and will in the end likely appease neither.

 

[Brad Sallows]

The problem with prices staying where they are is simple, if you don't already have property to use as equity or money from the sale of a property, you are unlikely to ever save enough for a down payment to get into the market. It will lock-in the current housing problem many people face.

If prices stabilize, people capable of saving money will be able to catch up as long as their income approximately keeps up with base inflation.

Of course, if the governments of the day keep pulling against the BoC's attempts to limit inflation (as is currently happening), inflation will tend to be higher than otherwise.

I'm not certain the CPC will work very hard to reduce the rate of growth of public spending, but I'm certain the LPC and NDP won't. No point in complaining much about stuff people won't vote to avoid.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Even the hard, hard left is underwhelmed with Team Red ....

Canada Feels Like a House of Cards Waiting to Collapse

In Canada, surging house prices, the G7’s highest household debt, nationwide climate-driven disasters, and punishing interest rates have turned the crisis knob to 11. Amid all this, the Trudeau Liberals are eyeing cuts, adding potential austerity to the mix.

jacobin.com

 

[Brad Sallows]

Even the hard, hard left is underwhelmed with Team Red ....

The hard, hard left asked for this.

"More spending programs, please."
"More centralization of government powers, please."
"More interference in markets not delivering results to our satisfaction, please."

The NDP are talking about asking for more, thinking the LPC will want to avoid an election.

The LPC should simply point to the parties' standings in recent polls. Maybe also ask about the contents of the NDP's campaign war chest.