Liberal Minority Government 2021 - ????

[daftandbarmy]

That's fair.

Given the governments past behavior on accountability do we expect them to answer questions in a straight forward informative manner? Or rip a page out of the Question Period book.

As we've seen, these Liberals are big criers


“Half of the people lie with their lips; the other half with their tears”

― Nassim Nicholas Taleb

 

[The Bread Guy]

... Given the governments past behavior on accountability do we expect them to answer questions in a straight forward informative manner? Or rip a page out of the Question Period book.

Team Red in Ottawa is just the latest group that's ... loose on responses in Question Period. And there's a reason it's not called "Answer Period"

 

[RangerRay]

I had to laugh when my wife was shocked, SHOCKED! that the Manitoba Tories weren’t answering questions in the Ledge during QP. She didn’t believe me when I told her is was ever thus and there was a reason it wasn’t called Answer Period. She is still scandalized!

 

[Remius]

The inquiry is set up to get answers as to why the EA was invoked. Most people here agree that it wasn’t necessary. The authorities are pretty sure that it helped though.

So far the LPC is struggling to explain it.

Mendencino at least it would seem has misled parliament by claiming the police asked for it and it seems that wasn’t the case. For that, calls for his resignation would be appropriate (and would have more weight if the opposition didn’t always call for resignations all the time).

Everything else seems political at this point. The electorate will decide when the time comes if any of this matters. I doubt though that most care. Two thirds of Canadians wanted that stuff stopped and it was. The same two thirds that weren’t on board with the protest are not likely to side with anyone that is looking for sympathy and Justice for the small amount of people who ended up affected by the EA.

The scale of the effect of the EA wasn’t wide enough to really affect enough people to care. So it’s likely the LPC will avoid any real fallout given how far off the election is. The CPC will try and use it against them but I’m not sure how effective that will be with the electorate.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Mendencino at least it would seem has misled parliament

Not even a fib, more like an honest mistake really.

 

[brihard]

The scale of the effect of the EA wasn’t wide enough to really affect enough people to care. So it’s likely the LPC will avoid any real fallout given how far off the election is. The CPC will try and use it against them but I’m not sure how effective that will be with the electorate.

Strong point. The only people affected by it were those directly involved, practically all of whose minds were very much made up already. The real tangible reach of this did not extend much past the protest/occupation sites, and the psychological reach did not extend much past those already ideologically aligned for or against the occupation.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Strong point. The only people affected by it were those directly involved, practically all of whose minds were very much made up already. The real tangible reach of this did not extend much past the protest/occupation sites, and the psychological reach did not extend much past those already ideologically aligned for or against the occupation.

If Mendencino told a judge instead of the parliament that the police asked for the EA would that have constituted perjury?

 

[The Bread Guy]

I had to laugh when my wife was shocked, SHOCKED! that the Manitoba Tories weren’t answering questions in the Ledge during QP. She didn’t believe me when I told her is was ever thus and there was a reason it wasn’t called Answer Period. She is still scandalized!

ALL team jersey colours do it when they're in whatever wheelhouse they happen to be in.

 

[brihard]

If Mendencino told a judge instead of the parliament that the police asked for the EA would that have constituted perjury?

I don’t know enough to say, and that’s one of those things where I’d be very selective in giving my opinion anyway.

 

[Remius]

ALL team jersey colours do it when they're in whatever wheelhouse they happen to be in.

Very true. Politicians everywhere rarely give straight answers.

As frustrating as our system may seem, Question Period allows our government to be questioned and challenged for all to see. In some countries that can get you jailed or worse.

 

[The Bread Guy]

More from the bought-and-paid-for media: "The Liberals face a summer of discontent -- The government has had a productive spring — but there are minefields ahead ..."

 

[Halifax Tar]

More from the bought-and-paid-for media: "The Liberals face a summer of discontent -- The government has had a productive spring — but there are minefields ahead ..."

Can you imagine a Conservative government that had the We scandal, SNC Lavlin scandal, JWR scandal, boondoggled the response to the Afg withdrawal, appeared impotent WRT the Ukraine or invoked the emergency measures act would be covered with the same effort by the CBC ?

 

[The Bread Guy]

Can you imagine a Conservative government that had the We scandal, SNC Lavlin scandal, JWR scandal, boondoggled the response to the Afg withdrawal, appeared impotent WRT the Ukraine or invoked the emergency measures act would be covered with the same effort by the CBC ?

To be fair, there was no shortage of CBC (and other usually-Redish) coverage of the WE and the AFG withdrawal. Emergency Act? Likely different, for sure.

 

[Halifax Tar]

To be fair, there was no shortage of CBC (and other usually-Redish) coverage of the WE and the AFG withdrawal. Emergency Act? Likely different, for sure.

Sometimes news can't help but cover a story, the spin and light they portray it in is where I get suspicious.

I imagine if Harper had done all those things we'd simply be hearing howls from the establishment Media for his resignation and the pure evil of Conservative mind set people.

 

[The Bread Guy]

... if Harper had done all those things we'd simply be hearing howls from the establishment Media for his resignation and the pure evil of Conservative mind set people.

Well, most of the legacy media (their editorial boards, anyway) have been pretty clear about their position on the Emergencies Act without attacking Team Blue supporters, anyway ...

Editorial | Invoking the Emergencies Act is a shocking admission of failure

‘Protests and blockades could and should already have been resolved by good intelligence, smart planning, and effective coordination among police forces.’

www.thestar.com

Globe editorial: Was the Emergencies Act justified? Without knowing what cabinet knew, it may be impossible to say

If the Trudeau government believed extraordinary circumstances were at play, it should be ready to take the equally extraordinary step of making sure that Canadians have all the evidence they need to be convinced it was right

www.theglobeandmail.com

Disobedience: The Emergencies Act and the long erosion of the rule of law in Canada

Howard Anglin: If there is to be any hope of avoiding further social fracture, it is long past time that Canada got serious about the consistent enforcement of laws

nationalpost.com

EDITORIAL: Nothing funny about invoking emergency law

On one level, federal Public Safety Minister Marco Mendicino’s continuing failure to produce an actual police force that actually asked the Trudeau government

torontosun.com

 

[Halifax Tar]

Well, most of the legacy media (their editorial boards, anyway) have been pretty clear about their position on the Emergencies Act without attacking Team Blue supporters, anyway ...

Editorial | Invoking the Emergencies Act is a shocking admission of failure

‘Protests and blockades could and should already have been resolved by good intelligence, smart planning, and effective coordination among police forces.’

www.thestar.com

Globe editorial: Was the Emergencies Act justified? Without knowing what cabinet knew, it may be impossible to say

If the Trudeau government believed extraordinary circumstances were at play, it should be ready to take the equally extraordinary step of making sure that Canadians have all the evidence they need to be convinced it was right

www.theglobeandmail.com

Disobedience: The Emergencies Act and the long erosion of the rule of law in Canada

Howard Anglin: If there is to be any hope of avoiding further social fracture, it is long past time that Canada got serious about the consistent enforcement of laws

nationalpost.com

EDITORIAL: Nothing funny about invoking emergency law

On one level, federal Public Safety Minister Marco Mendicino’s continuing failure to produce an actual police force that actually asked the Trudeau government

torontosun.com

Team blue isn't sitting in Gov. Team red has to wear this.

Do you think a team Blue gov would be getting the same treatment ? Harper was skewed for months on end over the Duffy affair which was a big nothing burger.

Bought and paid for media is best shown not in the title of article but with which the veracity and effort that it puts into influencing the populace.

I would argue we aren't seeing that same tenacity. A team blue government wouldn't have survived team reds first term with JT.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Team blue isn't sitting in Gov. Team red has to wear this.

For SURE!

Do you think a team Blue gov would be getting the same treatment ? Harper was skewed for months on end over the Duffy affair which was a big nothing burger.

Do you think traditionally small-c-conservative media (including the bought-and-paid-for Toronto Sun and National Post), not to mention the small-c-conservative amplifier sites and commentariat, would call a Team Red government letting a Team Red senator off the hook by first saying "good to go with your expenses", then seeing a PM Chief of Staff cut a cheque for said expenses, a "big nothing burger"? I'm not sure the Spencer Fernando's and Brian Lilley's of the world would have been OK with that

Bought and paid for media is best shown not in the title of article but with which the veracity and effort that it puts into influencing the populace.

And that can be harder to measure in a firm-data-over-a-long-term sort of way, especially when everybody quotes media they don't like when it agrees with their position, and attacks the very same outlets as "in the bag" when they don't like what's being said.

 

[Halifax Tar]

For SURE!

Do you think traditionally small-c-conservative media (including the bought-and-paid-for Toronto Sun and National Post), not to mention the small-c-conservative amplifier sites and commentariat, would call a Team Red government letting a Team Red senator off the hook by first saying "good to go with your expenses", then seeing a PM Chief of Staff cut a cheque for said expenses, a "big nothing burger"? I'm not sure the Spencer Fernando's and Brian Lilley's of the world would have been OK with that

And that can be harder to measure in a firm-data-over-a-long-term sort of way, especially when everybody quotes media they don't like when it agrees with their position, and attacks the very same outlets as "in the bag" when they don't like what's being said.

Funny how pale the Duffy affair seems now.

Anyways, I did some searching around and they did cover it. And not in a good light. But they both seemed to frame their positions as an attack on the Senate itself and using Duffy as a example.

So this brings me back to my original point which was basically who keeps the media onside ?

We have media on both sides right now publishing material that I think is meant to divide us and a divided country is fertile ground for bigger problems.

I think we've all been caught off guard with how much the media influences our lives and government and this needs to be reigned. I see it as a treat to our very existence as. Nation.

One need look no further than our southern neighbors to see what damage erroneous and intentionally divisive narratives can do to a people.

 

[The Bread Guy]

So this brings me back to my original point which was basically who keeps the media onside ?

Still a good question.

We have media on both sides right now publishing material that I think is meant to divide us and a divided country is fertile ground for bigger problems.

Slight nuance, here. Is the media trying to keep us divided, or other forces maybe using media as a weapon? I don't think the owner of the West Podunk Intelligencer is out to divide people, but there's folks out there happy to use media coverage as a bludgeon.

I think we've all been caught off guard with how much the media influences our lives and government and this needs to be reigned. I see it as a treat to our very existence as. Nation.

I have enough faith in the resilience of the national institutions (poorly led as they may be right now) that I don't see media bias as an existential threat to Canada. Like Oddball said on "Kelly's Heroes" ....

One need look no further than our southern neighbors to see what damage erroneous and intentionally divisive narratives can do to a people.

You're bang on there, and again, I think there's a case to be made that the media is a tool, not the driver. If one were conspiratorial enough, one might say forces wanting to drive us apart could blame the media as a way to deflect attention from who's really trying to divide us.

 

[QV]

Funny how pale the Duffy affair seems now.

Anyways, I did some searching around and they did cover it. And not in a good light. But they both seemed to frame their positions as an attack on the Senate itself and using Duffy as a example.

So this brings me back to my original point which was basically who keeps the media onside ?

We have media on both sides right now publishing material that I think is meant to divide us and a divided country is fertile ground for bigger problems.

I think we've all been caught off guard with how much the media influences our lives and government and this needs to be reigned. I see it as a treat to our very existence as. Nation.

One need look no further than our southern neighbors to see what damage erroneous and intentionally divisive narratives can do to a people.

One of the defenses for the media is "Look, they said something bad about Trudeau!". This is a weak defense. A 70/30 split is still far more damaging to one side and they know that. The Duffy affair or the $16 orange juice scandal are good examples of the drum being beaten endlessly on lesser offences than what we've experienced in the last 7 years.

This is psyops on a domestic political level. And we wouldn't know the half of it if it weren't for the internet... Bill C-11 enters the chat