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CDN/US Covid-related political discussion

Weinie

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I have been watching some of those states, particularly ones that are about an hour away from my house with considerable alarm over the past year. Despite a smaller population and lower density than Winnipeg, their COVID cases and death numbers were through the roof compared to us. However, now that vaccinations are ramping up in those states, we aren’t looking so good. Soon, our numbers will reverse. So I would say it’s the vaccination rate in those states that is making them look good, not their lack of restrictions.
For those who have been pointing their fingers, and scorn, south.

Canada’s COVID-19 case rate tops U.S. as country continues to lag in vaccinations
 

mariomike

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For those who have been pointing their fingers, and scorn, south.

Canada’s COVID-19 case rate tops U.S. as country continues to lag in vaccinations
For those who have been pointing their fingers, and scorn, north.

Covid-19 deaths per 100,000 population as of 9 April 2021.
United States 171.20
Canada 62.59

From the link in Reply #1,364
The country, lacking domestic vaccine manufacturing capacity, has relied entirely on imported shots.

As to why Canada lacks domestic vaccine manufacturing capacity,

 

LittleBlackDevil

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I have been watching some of those states, particularly ones that are about an hour away from my house with considerable alarm over the past year. Despite a smaller population and lower density than Winnipeg, their COVID cases and death numbers were through the roof compared to us. However, now that vaccinations are ramping up in those states, we aren’t looking so good. Soon, our numbers will reverse. So I would say it’s the vaccination rate in those states that is making them look good, not their lack of restrictions.

These states are ahead of Canada but I'm not sure they are so far ahead that one can just hand-wave away their dropping numbers as "thanks to vaccines". According to this site, only 35% of Americans have received at least one dose with 19% "fully vaccinated". This is well below is well below what we've been told would be necessary before a semblance of normal live could be countenanced. So according to "the science" their numbers should still be way higher than Canada. In Canada, 18% of people have received at least one dose.

I haven't looked up all of the states in question, but Texas, which is the state I referenced as the cause of much pearl clutching and condemnations when they dropped all mask and other restrictions on 2 March, ranks 45th out of all states for vaccination. 23% of their residents 18 and older have been vaccinated.

Yet to the contrary of everyone dying, deaths and new cases have both been dropping since the mandates were all dropped. Same with Florida. It seems that at best, lockdowns and other draconian measures only delay deaths. I think their efficacy when balanced against the long-term economic and social devastation, the lost childhoods, etc. can be questioned.
 

daftandbarmy

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How many non-medical "folks" would feel comfortable inoculating real people, even with rudimentary training? What if one (or more) made a mistake? What if the injectees felt uncomfortable with first-time jabbers?

How many non-medical military members would feel comfortable inoculating real people, even with rudimentary training?? What if one (or more) made a mistake? What if the injectees felt uncomfortable with being stuck by people with more training to insert bayonets than needles?

I doubt we'd need the equivalent of Platoon Patrol Medics running around jabbing people in the streets. Just making best use of the available resources is a huge win, if we can get our collective acts together on the organization side that is...
 

Brad Sallows

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Amazing what a change in administration can do. Especially one that doesn’t deny the issue and takes actual action.

The US is doing well because of what the previous administration and many of the state administrations set in motion and are doing now.
 

Blackadder1916

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Hire more folks.

Call in the military.

Whatever it takes.
How many non-medical "folks" would feel comfortable inoculating real people, even with rudimentary training? What if one (or more) made a mistake? What if the injectees felt uncomfortable with first-time jabbers?

How many non-medical military members would feel comfortable inoculating real people, even with rudimentary training?? What if one (or more) made a mistake? What if the injectees felt uncomfortable with being stuck by people with more training to insert bayonets than needles?

I'm one of those "injectees" who would be uncomfortable with being vaccinated by someone whose "medical training" was limited to solely sticking a needle into someone's upper arm. That comes from a perspective of someone who has instructed persons on the procedure. It's not rocket surgery; I could probably get a reasonably intelligent monkey to do it in a couple of days or an infanteer in a couple of hours (it's not as easy as jabbing yourself with an auto-injector), but neither would unlikely have any understanding of all the competencies required for parenteral drug administration. If I remember correctly, we were well into our TQ3 course (a month or more of the five plus months) before we tackled the subject (it was a full day of practical, IIRC, and the POC was done on another day), so a lot of the underlying theory had already been covered.

I received my first dose of the Pfizer vaccine about ten days ago, administered by a pharmacist. It wasn't at my regular pharmacy (that location doesn't have the physical set-up to safely, and economically, do Covid vaccinations - according to the pharmacist there) so I don't know how experienced the pharmacist who jabbed me was at injections, but she did seem very, very focused when drawing up (brought back memories of setting up my first needle parade and supervising TQ3s and 5s on their Ph2s back in the old days). As most pharmacists authorized to give vaccinations typically use single dose pre-loads, all the additional steps* to prepping the vaccine before injecting would have been a new experience. And for a licensed pharmacist (in Alberta anyway) the additional training before getting their College's approval would typically consist of about 11 hours of distance/on-line training and one day of practical (and a cost of $500 to $750).

There would also be additional legal hurdles to allow "non-medical" persons to administer injections. In Alberta, various acts and regulations (specifically the Government Organization Act and the Health Professions Act) and the regulatory colleges of the various professions provide limitations on who can do what to whom. Yes, there are measures in some of that legislation to permit ministerial override of certain things in the event of a public health emergency but I would expect that such measures would be more in the nature of permitting already professionally qualified groups licenced in another jurisdiction to practice in the province without having to go through the process of getting local credentials.

* For those interested in those steps https://covid-vaccine.canada.ca/info/pdf/pfizer-biontech-covid-19-steps-leaflet-en.pdf
 

Altair

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These states are ahead of Canada but I'm not sure they are so far ahead that one can just hand-wave away their dropping numbers as "thanks to vaccines". According to this site, only 35% of Americans have received at least one dose with 19% "fully vaccinated". This is well below is well below what we've been told would be necessary before a semblance of normal live could be countenanced. So according to "the science" their numbers should still be way higher than Canada. In Canada, 18% of people have received at least one dose.

I haven't looked up all of the states in question, but Texas, which is the state I referenced as the cause of much pearl clutching and condemnations when they dropped all mask and other restrictions on 2 March, ranks 45th out of all states for vaccination. 23% of their residents 18 and older have been vaccinated.

Yet to the contrary of everyone dying, deaths and new cases have both been dropping since the mandates were all dropped. Same with Florida. It seems that at best, lockdowns and other draconian measures only delay deaths. I think their efficacy when balanced against the long-term economic and social devastation, the lost childhoods, etc. can be questioned.
Could be seasonal though.

Last summer lead to a dramatic drop in cases in both countries as well. Seeing as Canada isn't really warm yet, this could also be the case.

Also, during this entire thing, Africa has been strangely immune to this pandemic.
 

Quirky

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Could be seasonal though.

Last summer lead to a dramatic drop in cases in both countries as well. Seeing as Canada isn't really warm yet, this could also be the case.

Also, during this entire thing, Africa has been strangely immune to this pandemic.

They have better healthcare in long term care.
 

Fishbone Jones

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Before I left on OP Cavalier, everyone was trained how to stick an IV. We practiced on each other. Apparently there is something where the Base Surgeon was satisfied with the training and if we had to do it overseas, we were covered under his signature. I might have that a little wrong on the authority side, but we did break each other's skin and were able to do it if warranted. An IV is more complicated than a simple jab so I don't see why laymen can't be taught and trusted to do vaccinations. Although, there would be the obligatory union fly in the ointment most likely.
 

PuckChaser

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Same thing happened for TCCC pers in Afghanistan, Dave. Some Rotos had TCCC trained pers authorized to do needle decompression, others were not. I was told by my Crse Sgt for TCCC that the authority rested with the TF Surg as we were performing procedures under his "licence" similar to what you were told. I'm sure some of the smart Med folks on here can clarify the actual process.
 

mariomike

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The US is doing well because of what the previous administration and many of the state administrations set in motion and are doing now.

If it makes you feel better sure...

I was curious to learn how Americans feel.​


According to 538
Less than a month after he assumed office, many more Americans approve of President Biden’s handling of the pandemic than former President Donald Trump’s.


( Sorry for the bold, my computer does it sometimes, not me. )
if the feds can get surprise shipments to the province then the province should be able to deliver them to patients.

May be a small thing. But, Ontario paramedics are going door to door to vaccinate seniors who are unable to make it to a clinic.
 

LittleBlackDevil

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Could be seasonal though.

Last summer lead to a dramatic drop in cases in both countries as well. Seeing as Canada isn't really warm yet, this could also be the case.

Also, during this entire thing, Africa has been strangely immune to this pandemic.

Seasonal? I suppose it could be, but that not what "the science" and "the experts" say. They were all screaming bloody murder and predicting carnage when Texas and Florida rescinded all emergency orders almost six weeks ago now. So according to them and their modelling, this should not be happening regardless of why it's happening. My point being that the effectiveness of lockdowns, masks et al, is quite unclear when places have done away with them (in circumstances where the experts said they were needed) and have their numbers dropping.

As for Africa, I don't know much about things there ... but I suspect they don't have the same main stream media that we do here.


They have better healthcare in long term care.

I suspect less media exposure.

I was curious to learn how Americans feel.​


According to 538


A fawning media according to whom one can do no wrong can do wonders for a president's approval rating, as opposed to a media that savages him at every turn and he can do no right. It would be fascinating (but impossible) to see how Americans (and Canadians for that matter) would feel about their leaders if media coverage were neutral/even-handed rather than highly partisan and biased.
 

mariomike

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A fawning media according to whom one can do no wrong can do wonders for a president's approval rating, as opposed to a media that savages him at every turn and he can do no right. It would be fascinating (but impossible) to see how Americans (and Canadians for that matter) would feel about their leaders if media coverage were neutral/even-handed rather than highly partisan and biased.
Negative news = fake news?

The Fake News is working overtime. Just reported that, despite the tremendous success we are having with the economy & all things else, 91% of the Network News about me is negative (Fake). Why do we work so hard in working with the media when it is corrupt? Take away credentials?

Media bias has always been a lively ( 70-page ) discussion. :)

 
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