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US, NATO Outta Afghanistan 2021

We might be missing an opportunity to build a 'Pale Settlement' somewhere so the various Special Forces organizations can train and prepare Afghan nationals, who are currently refugees, to liberate Taliban occupied Afghanistan when the time is right.

You know, kind of like the Bay of Pigs invasion but without the 'failure' part :)
Iran will hire them to fight in their proxies, which they have already been doing.
 
Not with a bang, and barely a whimper:


sneaking out brian griffin GIF by HULU
 
We might be missing an opportunity to build a 'Pale Settlement' somewhere so the various Special Forces organizations can train and prepare Afghan nationals, who are currently refugees, to liberate Taliban occupied Afghanistan when the time is right.

You know, kind of like the Bay of Pigs invasion but without the 'failure' part :)
I can’t remember where I read it, as it was several years ago. But I remember reading a lengthy article by a very senior US Military leader shortly after his retirement, and his argument had been Afghanistan should I have been an SF & Intelligence agency operation since the beginning.

Put in power who they wanted. Kill off who they didn’t. Clean up the power dynamic to help stabilize the country, and help develop industry in a way that would have Afghans at least somewhat able to generate income via legitimate means, even if the ‘government in power’ is also funding itself with opium sales.


Now? That option doesn’t even seem possible in the near future.

It was, however, very generous of the ANA to leave entire shipping containers of US supplied weapons & ammo for the taking. Getting to set up shop within the protection of a previous NATO FOB is nice, but newly supplied rifles, machine guns, grenades and RPGs? Gold mine!!

(The ANA were useless as hell during our tour, but that was just my limited experience with them. Maybe some of you ended up with a better lot than we did. Seeing them leaving entire shipping containers of weapons for the Taliban? Doesn’t surprise me, yet still surprised. I didn’t think they could be more useless…)

0.02
 
I can’t remember where I read it, as it was several years ago. But I remember reading a lengthy article by a very senior US Military leader shortly after his retirement, and his argument had been Afghanistan should I have been an SF & Intelligence agency operation since the beginning.

Put in power who they wanted. Kill off who they didn’t. Clean up the power dynamic to help stabilize the country, and help develop industry in a way that would have Afghans at least somewhat able to generate income via legitimate means, even if the ‘government in power’ is also funding itself with opium sales.


Now? That option doesn’t even seem possible in the near future.

It was, however, very generous of the ANA to leave entire shipping containers of US supplied weapons & ammo for the taking. Getting to set up shop within the protection of a previous NATO FOB is nice, but newly supplied rifles, machine guns, grenades and RPGs? Gold mine!!

(The ANA were useless as hell during our tour, but that was just my limited experience with them. Maybe some of you ended up with a better lot than we did. Seeing them leaving entire shipping containers of weapons for the Taliban? Doesn’t surprise me, yet still surprised. I didn’t think they could be more useless…)

0.02


Looks like the locals aren't rolling over without a stiff argument ...


Afghans say recent Taliban advances forced them to take up arms​

At least 500 residents in Parwan province pick up guns as the September 11 withdrawal deadline of US forces creeps closer.

Ghorband Valley, Afghanistan – Zahir Salangi, a member of Afghanistan’s parliament from the northern province of Parwan, had hoped to settle down on a “doshak” (cushion) to catch a quick nap when the sound of gunfire came pouring through the already damaged house he had set up as a base.

“I haven’t slept in four days,” he told Al Jazeera last week as he sat up to give orders to the nearly two dozen volunteer fighters he had recruited in the fight against the Taliban.

The volunteers say Taliban fighters routinely fire on them from the mountains surrounding the lush valley.

As Salangi rose to his feet, one of the fighters started to shout commands into the walkie-talkie. Piles of glass shards from previous gunfights broke into smaller pieces under the weight of his boots as he paced from one side of the room to the other.

“Respond! Don’t stop firing! Don’t leave them without an answer,” he said while the sounds of gunfire echoed from the mountaintops.

The men are among at least 500 local residents who have picked up guns in recent weeks as the September 11 withdrawal deadline of the United States’ forces creeps closer.

 
Looks like the locals aren't rolling over without a stiff argument ... too bad the SF program didn't seem to bolster their 'militia' potential:


Afghans say recent Taliban advances forced them to take up arms​

At least 500 residents in Parwan province pick up guns as the September 11 withdrawal deadline of US forces creeps closer.

Ghorband Valley, Afghanistan – Zahir Salangi, a member of Afghanistan’s parliament from the northern province of Parwan, had hoped to settle down on a “doshak” (cushion) to catch a quick nap when the sound of gunfire came pouring through the already damaged house he had set up as a base.

“I haven’t slept in four days,” he told Al Jazeera last week as he sat up to give orders to the nearly two dozen volunteer fighters he had recruited in the fight against the Taliban.

The volunteers say Taliban fighters routinely fire on them from the mountains surrounding the lush valley.

As Salangi rose to his feet, one of the fighters started to shout commands into the walkie-talkie. Piles of glass shards from previous gunfights broke into smaller pieces under the weight of his boots as he paced from one side of the room to the other.

“Respond! Don’t stop firing! Don’t leave them without an answer,” he said while the sounds of gunfire echoed from the mountaintops.

The men are among at least 500 local residents who have picked up guns in recent weeks as the September 11 withdrawal deadline of the United States’ forces creeps closer.

 
Where the hell were they 5/10/15/20 years ago?
Right!? Like damn… good to see, a decade or two late though.

Honestly it is good to see the locals aren’t letting them just roll in. I fear for their safety though - the Taliban WILL eventually come back to those areas, in strength, and with that ruthlessness they are known for.

It’ll be interesting to see if the ANA can reorganize themselves and retake these areas. With some SF help ofcourse.


Question - just wondering the thoughts of folks who have followed recent events more closely than I. If there was a different President in power, do you think it would be possible for the Taliban & government to work together?
 
Question - just wondering the thoughts of folks who have followed recent events more closely than I. If there was a different President in power, do you think it would be possible for the Taliban & government to work together?
It doesn't matter who the president is now, it only matters that Donnie T made peace with the Taliban to secure an exit strategy. He essentially hobbled any and all future presidents from propping up Kabul in order to score political points at home. He also will use this as a talking point in 2024, saying he set up the play, but Biden fumbled the ball.

The Taliban do not recognize the GIRoA as a legitimate entity and was never going to commit to a peace deal with them. With the U.S. no longer able to bring air support or SF pers to aid the ANA, its going to look like Saigon 1975 all over again.
 
It doesn't matter who the president is now, it only matters that Donnie T made peace with the Taliban to secure an exit strategy. He essentially hobbled any and all future presidents from propping up Kabul in order to score political points at home. He also will use this as a talking point in 2024, saying he set up the play, but Biden fumbled the ball.

The Taliban do not recognize the GIRoA as a legitimate entity and was never going to commit to a peace deal with them. With the U.S. no longer able to bring air support or SF pers to aid the ANA, its going to look like Saigon 1975 all over again.
I fear you are correct.

I imagine the US will be keeping some hard hitting SF capabilities in country, as will the intelligence agencies. (CIA, ahem.)

The US will still want the ability to react to things in some capacity. And I imagine there will be some shadowy stuff in the background with various Taliban leaders.


(Vietnam eventually became a lovely, tourist friendly country with a healthy tourism market, resorts, history excursions, etc. Do we think Afghanistan will ever turn that same corner, while any of us are still alive?)
 
Honestly it is good to see the locals aren’t letting them just roll in. I fear for their safety though - the Taliban WILL eventually come back to those areas, in strength, and with that ruthlessness they are known for.
IMO they are vicious murderers who need to be wiped off the face of the planet. I have a very visceral hatred of the Taliban and AQ.

You can expect anyone that worked along side allied forces to be "reeducated". I fear for their lives.
 
IMO they are vicious murderers who need to be wiped off the face of the planet. I have a very visceral hatred of the Taliban and AQ.

You can expect anyone that worked along side allied forces to be "reeducated". I fear for their lives.
Me too. Very much so.

I very much try to ‘tame’ my words these days, and try to be mindful of how I say certain things so don’t come across as an armchair general. (Or a psycho…)

But as much as we like to pamper our societies in the west, and blanket over people and things which are plainly evil with ‘educated nonsense’….

The world is overpopulated. The planet is facing real problems whether we want to acknowledge our role in it or not. And overpopulation is a notable contributor to current and future conflicts, the likes of which are unique and new.

When it comes to the Taliban, AQ, ISIS, Boko, etc etc - I wish it was as simple as wiping them off the planet. If they didn’t regenerate themselves (especially Taliban and AQ) it would be amazing.

The world doesn’t need girls having acid poured on them, schools being blown up, teachers and families threatened, bombs going off at Ariana Grande concerts (where the victims are teenaged girls) - etc etc.

It doesn’t need to have people who are illiterate & poor being manipulated into believing a higher power wants them to go kill innocents or blow themselves up. None of that.


I am with you. If there was a way to take them all out and not allow them to somehow regenerate, I’d be pushing hard for it.

I HOPE we at least got our interpreters here by now??
 
In view of the history of Afghanistan, I enjoy watching people argue for staying there.
 
In view of the history of Afghanistan, I enjoy watching people argue for staying there.

I don't advocate for staying in the quagmire. I just would have rather we got it to a manageable state, instead of climbing out on the backs of our unprepared allies.
 
In view of the history of Afghanistan, I enjoy watching people argue for staying there.
No kidding. I work with an Afghan who was raised in refugee camps in Pakistan.

He did mention that in the north of Afghanistan there are people with lighter skin and blue eyes, a legacy of Alexander the Great's attempt to conquer the place. He failed.
 
No kidding. I work with an Afghan who was raised in refugee camps in Pakistan.

He did mention that in the north of Afghanistan there are people with lighter skin and blue eyes, a legacy of Alexander the Great's attempt to conquer the place. He failed.

I think also the Soviet raping conquest has more to do with that phenomenon than ol' Sikandar Khan.
 
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