Op UNIFIER - CAF and the Ukraine Crisis

[Altair]

Any extra 2 days till they reach the polish border. That said, if shit hit the fan, all bets are off as to who jumps in the poop storm.

If America wanted to fight Russia to protect Ukraine they would be positioning troops now.

They are not going to let Poland drag them into any conflict with Russia. If Warsaw gave Washington the finger (which I doubt, but lets say they do) and jumped into Ukraine, Washington would leave them out to dry, same for anyone who is foolish enough to join them.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Any sense if the US/CDN troops based there even have personal weapons?

Their presence there is the weapon...

 

[MilEME09]

Their presence there is the weapon...

That doesn't help when a dozen Ukrainians with baseball bats show up to take your supplies. Yes it has happened, and we had to stand back and let them take it cause in 2016/17 they had no personal weapons.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

And if they would have, would they have used the wpns? If not...there's no difference really in terms of 'outcome' in that situation.

 

[FJAG]

The Florida National Guard is in the Ukraine:Florida National Guard troops are somehow caught up in Russia’s showdown with UkraineRed Storm Rising.BY JEFF SCHOGOL | PUBLISHED DEC 7, 2021 4:22 PMNEWSARMY

The Florida National Guard’s 53rd Infantry Brigade Combat Team unfurls its colors at a Nov. 30 ceremony in Ukraine. (From Joint Multinational Training Group-Ukraine's Facebook page.).

More than 100 Florida National Guard troops are currently deployed to Ukraine as U.S. intelligence officials continue to warn that Russia is poised to launch a crushing invasion of the country early next year.

While this small American force is based in western Ukraine – nearly 700 miles from the country’s eastern borders, where up to 175,000 Russian troops are reportedly massing – the presence of U.S. troops in Ukraine adds even more volatility to an already combustible situation.

In early November, about 165 soldiers of the Florida National Guard’s 53rd Infantry Brigade Combat Team prepared to leave for their deployment to Ukraine, Niko Clemmons of WFLA-TV in Tampa reported at the time.
These National Guard troops are not allowed to accompany Ukrainian forces into combat, said Marine Lt. Col. Anton T. Semelroth, a Pentagon spokesman.
Semelroth also said that U.S. special operations forces regularly conduct exercises with their Ukrainian counterparts. He declined to say how many American troops are currently deployed to Ukraine, citing security concerns.

Semelroth’s comments come after Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin declined to answer when asked by Defense One reporter Tara Copp if U.S. troops would fight alongside the Ukrainian forces that they’ve trained.
“I won’t speculate on what could happen in that instance,” Austin said in a Dec. 3 interview that was posted on Tuesday. “I would just say that No. 1: Our goal is to make sure that it doesn’t happen. We’re working with our international partners and allies to ensure that we convey to Russia that this is a really bad idea.”

On Monday, a senior administration official declined to say publicly if U.S. troops could be called on to respond to a Russian invasion of Ukraine. ...

Florida National Guard troops are somehow caught up in Russia's showdown with Ukraine

Red Storm Rising.

taskandpurpose.com

 

[daftandbarmy]

The Florida National Guard is in the Ukraine:Florida National Guard troops are somehow caught up in Russia’s showdown with UkraineRed Storm Rising.BY JEFF SCHOGOL | PUBLISHED DEC 7, 2021 4:22 PMNEWSARMY

 

[Altair]

Who want to bet that the invasion beings in and around February 4th, the opening of the Beijing Olympics, like the time he invaded Georgia?

 

[CBH99]

Who want to bet that the invasion beings in and around February 4th, the opening of the Beijing Olympics, like the time he invaded Georgia?

While the world is distracted with the Beijing Olympics? Attack while the world is focused on something else…smart.

And Mr. Putin is smart.

In Georgia, the Russians had a very limited objective. The conflict was short and brutally one sided, and very much kept Georgia as a border country/state under Russian influence, rather than the West.


100,000 - 175,000 troops for Ukraine seems a bit much if their only objective is to achieve total victory in the area they have been focused on.

175,000 seems a lot more akin to invading the whole country, no? Or at least drawing in the entire Ukrainian Armed Forces…

 

[CBH99]

That doesn't help when a dozen Ukrainians with baseball bats show up to take your supplies. Yes it has happened, and we had to stand back and let them take it cause in 2016/17 they had no personal weapons.

What the actual f*k? *Seriously?

I have so many questions on this… why not personal weapons? How did the mob get on base? What kinds of supplies did they take?

Who decided to deploy them without the fundamental basic protection of a sidearm? (Not that that would have altered things if they could not be used…)



My only deployments were to Afghanistan, and we had to have our weapons on us at almost all times. Like all the bloody time.

So my wee brain is having a hard time understanding that our troops there wouldn’t have had a sidearm on them for precisely this kind of situation.

 

[Altair]

While the world is distracted with the Beijing Olympics? Attack while the world is focused on something else…smart.

And Mr. Putin is smart.

Smart but a wee bit predictable at this point.

Just after the Sochi games in 2014 he started the little green men op in Crimea.

2008 Beijing Olympics he invaded Georgia.

But he hasn't failed yet.

In Georgia, the Russians had a very limited objective. The conflict was short and brutally one sided, and very much kept Georgia as a border country/state under Russian influence, rather than the West.

Mission accomplished for Russia.

100,000 - 175,000 troops for Ukraine seems a bit much if their only objective is to achieve total victory in the area they have been focused on.

I don't think that's enough to occupy the entire country. But it's certainly enough for seizing good portions of eastern Ukraine with follow up elements to hold on to gains.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Doesn't half of Ukraine side with Russia anyways?

 

[KevinB]

Doesn't half of Ukraine side with Russia anyways?

That's what Vlad wants you to think. Given they and China are pretty good with flooding areas with "local" agitators, they certainly try to portray that.
While I am certain that some Ukrainians may have felt an attachment to Russia, I wouldn't accept even 5% as the number, and definitely not 50%.

 

[MilEME09]

What the actual f*k? *Seriously?

I have so many questions on this… why not personal weapons? How did the mob get on base? What kinds of supplies did they take?

Who decided to deploy them without the fundamental basic protection of a sidearm? (Not that that would have altered things if they could not be used…)



My only deployments were to Afghanistan, and we had to have our weapons on us at almost all times. Like all the bloody time.

So my wee brain is having a hard time understanding that our troops there wouldn’t have had a sidearm on them for precisely this kind of situation.

Corruption and a lack of proper security appear to be a staple of Ukraine. Apparently things have changed now from what I heard.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

That doesn't help when a dozen Ukrainians with baseball bats show up to take your supplies. Yes it has happened, and we had to stand back and let them take it cause in 2016/17 they had no personal weapons.

Ukrainian's play Baseball!?

Shoulda just given er any style!

 

[daftandbarmy]

Corruption and a lack of proper security appear to be a staple of Ukraine. Apparently things have changed now from what I heard.

When it comes to corruption, they're awesome. We might be propping up another South Vietnam:

​

Corruption is widespread in Ukrainian society.[1][2] In 2012 Ernst & Young put Ukraine among the three most-corrupt nations of the world - alongside Colombia and Brazil.[3] In 2015 The Guardian called Ukraine "the most corrupt nation in Europe".[4] According to a poll conducted by Ernst & Young in 2017, experts considered Ukraine to be the ninth-most corrupt nation in the world.[5] According to the Transparency International's Corruption Perceptions Index, Ukraine ranked 117th out of 180 countries in 2020, ranking the second lowest in Europe, after Russia.[6]

United States diplomats described Ukraine under Presidents Kuchma (in office from 1994 to 2005) and Yushchenko (in office from 2005 to 2010) as a kleptocracy, according to WikiLeaks cables.[7]

Corruption in Ukraine - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Czech_pivo]

When it comes to corruption, they're awesome. We might be propping up another South Vietnam:

​

Corruption is widespread in Ukrainian society.[1][2] In 2012 Ernst & Young put Ukraine among the three most-corrupt nations of the world - alongside Colombia and Brazil.[3] In 2015 The Guardian called Ukraine "the most corrupt nation in Europe".[4] According to a poll conducted by Ernst & Young in 2017, experts considered Ukraine to be the ninth-most corrupt nation in the world.[5] According to the Transparency International's Corruption Perceptions Index, Ukraine ranked 117th out of 180 countries in 2020, ranking the second lowest in Europe, after Russia.[6]

United States diplomats described Ukraine under Presidents Kuchma (in office from 1994 to 2005) and Yushchenko (in office from 2005 to 2010) as a kleptocracy, according to WikiLeaks cables.[7]

Corruption in Ukraine - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

That was under the former pro-russian government, that the pro-western Ukrainians threw out, starting this whole mess with Putin.

For certain there is still corruption there, and it will continue to exist for years to come, but the current government has aggressively moved to knock it back and to continue to knock it back.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

That was under the former pro-russian government, that the pro-western Ukrainians threw out, starting this whole mess with Putin.

For certain there is still corruption there, and it will continue to exist for years to come, but the current government has aggressively moved to knock it back and to continue to knock it back.

Yes, they magically became less corrupt because they changed the colour of their draperies

Corruption is a cultural and societal issue. It's not because the Politicians change that these societies magically become less corrupt.

 

[Czech_pivo]

Yes, they magically became less corrupt because they changed the colour of their draperies

Corruption is a cultural and societal issue. It's not because the Politicians change that these societies magically become less corrupt.

Corruption is a poverty issue - and lack of a strong independent judicial system.

Ukraine is either the poorest country in Europe or among the top 2 or 3. Widespread apathy among the former pro-Kremlin government officials made the issue systematic and more ingrained in society.

The current government has moved to address this issue, but it will take decades to resolve and it will only work if the standard of living of all Ukrainians increases, from the pensioner to the young people just joining the workforce, to those in the prime working/earning years.

I definitely saw and heard this on a daily/weekly basis when I was living/working in Prague in the mid 90's. Everyone was angling for their slice of the pie, everyone wanted to improve their own personal situation and bribes worked.

I also remember a trip to St. Petersburg Russia in the early 90's when I was attending university in Belgium. I went to visit a Finnish friend in Helsinki who had wrapped up his studies in Belgium. He was able to get me to join with this class trip, at the U of Helsinki, for a long weekend to St. Petersburg. On the ferry ride over, he and his male friends were telling me to buy a carton of Marlboro cigarettes from the Duty Free store on board. I asked why as I didn't smoke, they said 'you'll see.' So I bought them. We were being given accommodations by the hosting faculty at the U of St. Petersburg within their student dormitories. After the welcoming ceremonies by the hosting faculty, the Finns (and me as the only non-Finn) and Russians students started to eat, drink and mingle. It was then when it become apparent as to why the carton of Marlboro's was purchased......young, beautiful Russian girl students were coming up and asking if we had cigarettes. When we said yes, they basically said that they 'would help keep us us warm at night during our stay' since the heating in the dormitories rarely worked. A carton of Marlboro's was the price. Desperate times (poverty) leads to desperate actions.

 

[Edward Campbell]

This, by James Jay Carafano, a pretty staunch "conservative," as Americans, usually mistakenly, use that term, is a call to ... well, to something short of arms.

 

[Czech_pivo]

This, by James Jay Carafano, a pretty staunch "conservative," as Americans, usually mistakenly, use that term, is a call to ... well, to something short of arms.

One other area that they continue to exert pressure and continue to use as their proxy is Serbia.
Note the recent tensions between Montenegro and Serbia over the new Orthodox Bishop in Montenegro. Montenegro is Georgia is this scenario and Serbia is Russia. Don’t forgot or discount this area of Europe as yet another area of potential conflict and destabilization.