CMMA - replacing the CP140 Aurora

[Good2Golf]

Hey, we could most certainly join a developmental MPA program with France on the A220 with Bombardier and Airbus along with General Dynamics.
Take 10 years to develop, insist we have no obligation to buy, yell that we need to have a fly off with someone and something.
Sounds like a great plan!

 

[childs56]

Bombardier knows that they are only competitive for Canadian contracts due to domestic politics, marketing a MPA similar to what they have pitched has already been tried and it failed horribly. Saab pitched their 'Swordfish' concept around 2017~, a pretty conservative Bombardier Global 6000 modification which attempted to be exported abroad to just such a market. They received seemingly no serious interest and by late 2018, Saab had shelved the concept entirely. There is seemingly little want abroad for a cheaper and less capable MPA currently, Bombardier on their own would be in an even worse scenario compared to a more capable company like Saab.

PAL Aerospace has pitched their version of MPA with Thales a couple of years ago Based on the Global 6500. I guess at the IDEX show in Abu Dhabi back in Feb the pitched it again and brought it to the forefront of MPA. Kind of curious as to how they will move ahead but if UAE buys the plane then it will start the ball rolling. From their statement they are waiting on Canada to choose between the P8 and the PAL/ Bombardier version.
I guess time will tell. I don't think this plane is far off from being a reality. They already have extensive experience with surveillance aircraft using sensor suits and integration. Money may not be a problem, the only problem is Bombardier couldn't succeed if you gave them a billion dollars to build the plane, without asking for another two billion for a bail out.

 

[childs56]

Bombardier knows that they are only competitive for Canadian contracts due to domestic politics, marketing a MPA similar to what they have pitched has already been tried and it failed horribly. Saab pitched their 'Swordfish' concept around 2017~, a pretty conservative Bombardier Global 6000 modification which attempted to be exported abroad to just such a market. They received seemingly no serious interest and by late 2018, Saab had shelved the concept entirely. There is seemingly little want abroad for a cheaper and less capable MPA currently, Bombardier on their own would be in an even worse scenario compared to a more capable company like Saab.

PAL Aerospace has pitched their version of MPA with Thales a couple of years ago Based on the Global 6500. I guess at the IDEX show in Abu Dhabi back in Feb the pitched it again and brought it to the forefront of MPA. Kind of curious as to how they will move ahead but if UAE buys the plane then it will start the ball rolling. From their statement they are waiting on Canada to choose between the P8 and the PAL/ Bombardier version.
I guess time will tell. I don't think this plane is far off from being a reality. They already have extensive experience with surveillance aircraft using sensor suits and integration. Money may not be a problem, the only problem is Bombardier couldn't succeed if you gave them a billion dollars to build the plane, without asking for another two billion for a bail out.

 

[GR66]

To my mind Bombardier is playing this pretty stupidly. They're just pissing people off by trying to weasel their way into the CMMA program. I think they would have been better off pitching Canada on a couple of Global Eye platforms as part of the NORAD upgrades.

The new NORAD ground-based radars will be good at detecting aircraft and missiles approaching North America but tracking cruise missiles once they are over land would be better done with an airborne radar. Global Eye's maritime surface search radar could also allow it to supplement the P-8's in patrolling our maritime domain. The added bonus is that it's an in service platform with no new development required. Throw in a VIP version or two to free up some of the MRTT usage. Wins all around.

If Bombardier wants more military business then they should lean into their experience in developing long range, smaller airframe jets and work on a loyal wingman platform. The market in these, both in Canada and internationally, will certainly be far greater than an MPA.

 

[suffolkowner]

Bombardier isnt even thinking this through properly. Where would a Global Express 6500 ASW/MPA even rank on the list of contenders

1. Boeing Poseidon P8
2. Kawasaki P1
3. Airbus 295 MPA/Persuader
4th???

 

[Good2Golf]

Bombardier isnt even thinking this through properly. Where would a Global Express 6500 ASW/MPA even rank on the list of contenders

1. Boeing Poseidon P8
2. Kawasaki P1
3. Airbus 295 MPA/Persuader
4th???

Hint…it’s not about the capability.

 

[dapaterson]

At one point Lockheed was muttering about a roll on MPA kit for the C130J. I suspect their paper aircraft is ahead of Bombardier's paper aircraft, and I suspect they've done nothing with it...

PARIS: Lockheed unveils maritime patrol kit for C-130 Hercules

Lockheed Martin is working on a maritime patrol aircraft retrofit kit for the C-130 Hercules.

www.flightglobal.com

 

[dapaterson]

At one point Lockheed was muttering about a roll on MPA kit for the C130J. I suspect their paper aircraft is ahead of Bombardier's paper aircraft, and I suspect they've done nothing with it...

PARIS: Lockheed unveils maritime patrol kit for C-130 Hercules

Lockheed Martin is working on a maritime patrol aircraft retrofit kit for the C-130 Hercules.

www.flightglobal.com

I do like the concept of load masters kicking torps out the back door...

 

[Good2Golf]

I do like the concept of load masters kicking torps out the back door...

And they would still be environmentally controlled like in a P-3, CP-140, P-1, P-8 and….yeah, those.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

And they would still be environmentally controlled like in a P-3, CP-140, P-1, P-8 and….yeah, those.

No no no- you forgot about Bombardier’s “brilliant” bolt on weapons bay.

I’ll bet that there is no parasite drag there…

 

[KevinB]

No no no- you forgot about Bombardier’s “brilliant” bolt on weapons bay.

I’ll bet that there is no parasite drag there…

Isn’t all of Bombardier parasitic?

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Isn’t all of Bombardier parasitic?

They build a nice line of executive jets.

 

[dapaterson]

And they would still be environmentally controlled like in a P-3, CP-140, P-1, P-8 and….yeah, those.

Look at mister "just because it's in a glossy pamphlet doesn't mean it's technically possible".

 

[Good2Golf]

That’s Mister, with a capital M.

 

[Kirkhill]

That’s Mister, with a capital M.
View attachment 81267

Mr. President?

Will Dwayne ‘The Rock’ Johnson run for president?

When Barack Obama addressed Americans from the White House to tell them that Osama bin Laden was dead, Pennsylvania Avenue was already full of people chanting “

www.thetimes.co.uk

But then again, No!

The Rock shuts down idea of ever being US President: “Things are so f***ed up” - Dexerto

The Rock revealed on the Joe Rogan podcast that he was approached by a political party at the end of 2022 to run for President.

www.dexerto.com

 

[dimsum]

At one point Lockheed was muttering about a roll on MPA kit for the C130J. I suspect their paper aircraft is ahead of Bombardier's paper aircraft, and I suspect they've done nothing with it...

PARIS: Lockheed unveils maritime patrol kit for C-130 Hercules

Lockheed Martin is working on a maritime patrol aircraft retrofit kit for the C-130 Hercules.

www.flightglobal.com

Are those rotary launchers for the Sonos? If so, how do they roll on/off without needing to cut through the underside of the airframe?

 

[dapaterson]

Are those rotary launchers for the Sonos? If so, how do they roll on/off without needing to cut through the underside of the airframe?

Look at mister "just because it's in a glossy pamphlet doesn't mean it's technically possible".

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Here’s a picture of what a buddy of mine in the fleet thinks the actual CMMA will look like. I’m proud to say that I mentioned the “bomb thingies” looked too aggressive which lead to the add-on bubble making guns.

 

[dapaterson]

Here’s a picture of what a buddy of mine in the fleet thinks the actual CMMA will look like. I’m proud to say that I mentioned the “bomb thingies” looked too aggressive which lead to the add-on bubble making guns.

View attachment 81271

Nah, not a Twin Otter.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Are those rotary launchers for the Sonos? If so, how do they roll on/off without needing to cut through the underside of the airframe?

It appears that they are lined up with the troop door in the back.