Canada/US Border Integrity Thread

[brihard]

There's a fair bit of non customs and immigration criminal stuff that goes on there, just like everywhere else

I've had a front row seat on my patio to both vehicle and boat pursuits over the years including one arrest where the subject was OC'd at the end of my driveway while the wife and I were having our morning coffee outside. Breakfast and a show.

I meant for CBSA, sorry.

 

[KevinB]

AMPS has jurisdiction in both Ontario and Québec.

Fox in the Chicken Coop…

 

[OldSolduer]

Why is this so complicated? Is the border NOT the responsibility of the CBSA? Maybe some needs to school me in this regard.

 

[brihard]

Why is this so complicated? Is the border NOT the responsibility of the CBSA? Maybe some needs to school me in this regard.

CBSA is ports of entry. RCMP is everything else in between, under their federal policing branch. In some areas there are multiple police services doing the normal first response/call 911 stiff but also municipal or provincial level drugs and human trafficking, so they’re relevant partners. Cornwall is the most batshit crazy example.

 

[OldSolduer]

CBSA is ports of entry. RCMP is everything else in between, under their federal policing branch. In some areas there are multiple police services doing the normal first response/call 911 stiff but also municipal or provincial level drugs and human trafficking, so they’re relevant partners. Cornwall is the most batshit crazy example.

Thank you - now I understand.
So why don't we have a border dude (not czar - that's nuts) or dudette to oversee border ops?

 

[brihard]

Thank you - now I understand.
So why don't we have a border dude (not czar - that's nuts) or dudette to oversee border ops?

Well, there’s someone in charge of CBSA, there’s someone in charge of RCMP border integrity, and I imagine they’re in pretty frequent contact. I don’t know if within any of our government departments there’s a Deputy Minister or ADM specifically for the border. Maybe there is?

 

[OldSolduer]

Well, there’s someone in charge of CBSA, there’s someone in charge of RCMP border integrity, and I imagine they’re in pretty frequent contact. I don’t know if within any of our government departments there’s a Deputy Minister or ADM specifically for the border. Maybe there is?

Contact is good - what I think is needed off the top of my head - and I don't want to create a new agency - is a birder dude with reps from every province (incl NL) and and integrated border unit? CBSA, RCMP, CSIS, Local cops, OPP etc. Am I going the right way?

 

[Weinie]

Contact is good - what I think is needed off the top of my head - and I don't want to create a new agency - is a birder dude with reps from every province (incl NL) and and integrated border unit? CBSA, RCMP, CSIS, Local cops, OPP etc. Am I going the right way?

Chickens flew the coop enters the chat.

 

[OldSolduer]

Chickens flew the coop enters the chat.

Well birds are smrt….

 

[Haggis]

Well, there’s someone in charge of CBSA, there’s someone in charge of RCMP border integrity, and I imagine they’re in pretty frequent contact. I don’t know if within any of our government departments there’s a Deputy Minister or ADM specifically for the border. Maybe there is?

There is not.

@OldSolduer the RCMP has a Commissioner, who is most of the time, a cop. The CBSA has a president who is generally a public servant and has never worked the line. The RCMP receives somewhere in the neighbourhood of $200M annually to patrol the border. The CBSA is prevented from doing so by a 1930's era OIC which took that responsibility away from their predecessor agency. Neither organization is adequately funded or staffed to properly carry out the border integrity mission.

 

[Remius]

Contact is good - what I think is needed off the top of my head - and I don't want to create a new agency - is a birder dude with reps from every province (incl NL) and and integrated border unit? CBSA, RCMP, CSIS, Local cops, OPP etc. Am I going the right way?

Sounds like what Public Safety Canada is supposed to do.

 

[Czech_pivo]

There is not.

@OldSolduer the RCMP has a Commissioner, who is most of the time, a cop. The CBSA has a president who is generally a public servant and has never worked the line. The RCMP receives somewhere in the neighbourhood of $200M annually to patrol the border. The CBSA is prevented from doing so by a 1930's era OIC which took that responsibility away from their predecessor agency. Neither organization is adequately funded or staffed to properly carry out the border integrity mission.

And that sounds definitely like the Canadian way of doing things.

 

[lenaitch]

Sounds like what Public Safety Canada is supposed to do.

But Public Safety Canada is not a law enforcement agency.

To me, common sense would suggest that, if there is a need for a singular, all singin' - all dancin', federal agency responsible for border protection and control, it should be the CBSA. Implementing that would likely take decades.

 

[Remius]

But Public Safety Canada is not a law enforcement agency.

I know. And neither is CSIS or the parole board or any number of adjacent orgs. Public Safety is the department that is supposed to in theory be coordinating all those pieces.

To me, common sense would suggest that, if there is a need for a singular, all singin' - all dancin', federal agency responsible for border protection and control, it should be the CBSA. Implementing that would likely take decades.

Like I said. We have that already. Not sure if it is being done right or not.

About Public Safety Canada

Public Safety Canada was created in 2003 to ensure coordination across all federal departments and agencies responsible for national security and the safety of Canadians.

www.publicsafety.gc.ca

It has a whole section on border strategies in its mandate.

 

[dapaterson]

Neither organization is adequately funded or staffed to properly carry out the border integrity mission.

Which is why Han Island happened.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

But Public Safety Canada is not a law enforcement agency.

To me, common sense would suggest that, if there is a need for a singular, all singin' - all dancin', federal agency responsible for border protection and control, it should be the CBSA. Implementing that would likely take decades.

Changing/replacing an OIC can be done normally without parliamentary approval as long as it stays within the bounds of the Act it was written under. So that part can be done quickly. Offer up CBSA jobs to current PSAC members willing to meet the requirements to start bolstering the force. Adapt the MOU with the RCMP to accommodate a growing CBSA role. RCMP might also want to consider their long term role in supporting the border as the shift away from urban policing continues.

 

[OldSolduer]

“Tactically and strategically”

I don’t think JT has a clue what that means.

 

[Good2Golf]

Which is why Han Island happened.

Isn’t that Macau?

 

[FJAG]

To me, common sense would suggest that, if there is a need for a singular, all singin' - all dancin', federal agency responsible for border protection and control, it should be the CBSA. Implementing that would likely take decades.

Maybe if they changed the name from "Canadian Border Services Agency" to "Canadian Border Security Agency" it would set the tone for the overarching mission?

9D and I came back from 5 weeks in the US today flying in direct to London YXU. First time I ever cleared customs there. It actually looked like a pretty good operation and went darn quickly, compared to the US one in Toronto going out which was so screwed up and backlogged that we missed our connecting flight south notwithstanding that we had well over an hour between flights. (I recall that in the past there used to be folks polling the line and expediting people who had tight connections - no such thing - nobody gave a flying f*** - Toronto airport sucks big time. My last four experiences there have been problematic. I detest the place almost as much as I detest Air Canada.)

Coming back we had filled out our cards which said we weren't brining back weapons, booze, cigarettes or marijuana etc and that I had brought back $0.00 of items and 9D $200.00 of items against each of our $800.00 exemptions. So what question did the agent ask my wife? "What did you buy for $200.00?" I couldn't quite understand if this was legitimate curiosity or an attempt to break her into confessing that after a lifetime of not smoking her suitcase was stuffed with American ciggies. In any event it certainly got me recalling this discussion thread and where CBSA's emphasis seems to be.

 

[dapaterson]

Every time I return and have to stop at customs (no Nexus here) I make sure I have one hand full of my receipts. It's an effective deterrent to CBSA questions, since they assume I am ready.

I've also discovered that if you earnestly declare that you have two 26oz bottles of booze and want to declare one, they look at you incredulously and then wave you through.