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Windsor Supports Terrorism?

I was just getting tired of all these buildings getting spray painted with graffiti urban art, but now I see where we can have these individuals showcase their artistic abilities!
This sort of advertisement may be borderline illegal or against something or other here in Canada, but I sure wouldn't mind shite like this being reworked/defaced by these young vandals at all!
Poor bastards in sleepy Windsor probably had absolutely no clue as to who those faces were let alone what the hell the billboard said(in Arabic). You would think these part-time Canadians would be a little more appreciative of their extraction from Lebanon and not pull this crap on unsuspecting people. This crap just wouldn't fly in the USA!
 
I think two words simple words  1.5 metres high, saying "GO HOME" should be artistically endowed on this billboard!

Any takers  :P

On a serious note, they know this type of propaganda both offends us and scares us, and they thrive on that shyte. I can't beileve it was allowed to go through.

Most will bury their heads in the sand about it.

Wes
 
Wesley  Down Under said:
On a serious note, they know this type of propaganda both offends us and scares us, and they thrive on that shyte. I can't beileve it was allowed to go through

And on that note, let's hope that it finds itself where it belongs... taken down and ASAP. Especially after reading the article you have recently updated us on ZC!

~Rebecca
 
But Sam Ali, a 39-year-old Lebanese-born Windsor resident, said he supports the billboard's message, and he believes many in the city's Lebanese population feel the same way.

According to Ali, the accusations that Hezbollah is terrorist are untrue. "Hezbollah is freedom fighting. Whoever calls them terrorist is a liar," he said.

Ali, a Muslim, said Nasrallah has done good things, helping people with hospitals and medicine. "When Nasrallah speaks in Lebanon, a million and a half or two million people go into the street to listen."

Fellow Lebanese native and Muslim Ghina Maawie said she doesn't understand why anyone would be offended by the billboard. "When I saw it, I felt so happy and so proud of it," she said. "In Canada, we have freedom of speech."

Maawie also dismissed the criticisms of Hezbollah. "For anyone to defend Lebanon, they call them terrorist. All we did is defend our country."

OK I have a big problem with this, if they feel so close to their beloved Lebanon, why are they here in Canada? If they feel that strongly about defending it, why are they here in Canada and not over there defending it? Sounds like they like to talk the talk, but not walk the walk. First and foremost they gave up those rights to defend it when they came to Canada, they ran away is a much simpler term. Now from halfway around the world they suddenly feel compelled and brave enough to speak out. "Poppycock" In my eyes their nothing but a bunch of Benadict Arnold, turncoats. And as for freedom of speech, their is a limit to what is tolerated in Canada, such as openly supporting known terrorist groups. I do hope CSIS is all over this.

I think two words simple words  1.5 metres high, saying "GO HOME" should be artistically endowed on this billboard!

Any takers  

Wholeheartedly!!!

Good Lord, I'm so very tired of this garbage.
 
retiredgrunt45 said:
.....if they feel so close to their beloved Lebanon, why are they here in Canada?

Good Lord, I'm so very tired of this garbage.

Are they Canadians, or muslims living in Canada?

The question has been answered.

Christian Lebs would overall be offended, its that other 'peaceful' religion (you know the ones that beheads hostages) which are in favour of this billboard

Welcome to the real world Canucks, and fasten your seatbelts!


Wes
 
Margaret Wente stumbled into the ‘right’ definition of the problem in her recent column in the Globe and Mail which is reproduced here under the Fair Dealing provisions (§29) of the Copyright Act:

  http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070810.wcowente11/BNStory/Front/home
Bumbling along in search of the new ‘we'

MARGARET WENTE

From Saturday's Globe and Mail
August 10, 2007 at 8:34 PM EDT

Twice a week, my husband and I drive past the new Hindu temple in northwest Toronto. Built from 24,000 pieces of hand-carved marble and limestone, it is a testament to devotion, and to the astonishing diversity of Canada's biggest city. A few kilometres up the road are a shopping mall with stores selling South Asian and Caribbean food, and a vast new subdivision where men in turbans and splendid white beards stroll along the sidewalks. Nearby, another temple dwarfs the small old church across the street.

I like all of this. Whenever I ride into the city on the subway, I am reminded that my face is fast becoming a minority – just another minority in a sea of minorities. I don't mind. It makes me feel as if I'm living in a Coke commercial, a world of perfect harmony, the sort of idealized world I dreamed about when I was in Grade 8 and studied the United Nations. Most people I know feel the same way, vaguely self-congratulatory over what we imagine to be Canada's amazing multicultural success story.

Indeed, we have plenty to congratulate ourselves about. We don't have race riots or interethnic wars. Nobody is passing bylaws to discourage immigrants from moving in next door.

Yet, there are signs that not all is well in paradise. Immigrants aren't catching up as quickly as they used to, and many of them never catch up at all. An alarming number of their kids say they aren't very attached to Canada, and don't really feel Canadian. If there's nothing that's driving us apart, there's nothing that's gluing us together, either.

And, now, along comes Robert Putnam, an influential social scientist from Harvard who has done the biggest study yet on diversity and its impact. His findings are unequivocal: Diversity has a negative impact on community and social cohesion. It diminishes what he calls our “social capital” – our networks of friendship, neighbourhood and trust.

“Diversity, at least in the short run, seems to bring out the turtle in all of us,” he writes. People who live in more diverse communities tend to “distrust their neighbours, regardless of the colour of their skin, to withdraw even from close friends, to expect the worst from their community and its leaders, to volunteer less, give less to charity and work on community projects less often, to register to vote less, to agitate for social reform more but have less faith that they can actually make a difference, and to huddle unhappily in front of the television.” People who are disengaged from their community lose their taste for social spending. They're far less likely to believe in welfare, or more school funding, when they think those benefiting are not like them.

Mr. Putnam isn't all that thrilled with what he's found. He checked and cross-checked his data for years before publishing his findings. By inclination, he is liberal-minded, and he knows his work will be used by racists and nativists to prove they were right all along. “It's not pleasant to be called a hero on David Duke's website,” he says, referring to the former Ku Klux Klan leader.

He also believes there are ways to remedy the negative effects of diversity – once we acknowledge that those effects are real. “It would be unfortunate if a politically correct progressivism were to deny the reality of the challenge to social solidarity posed by diversity,” he writes.

This is awkward stuff. Mr. Putnam's work is a sharp rebuke to the brand of feel-good multiculturalism that has ruled Canada for decades – the sunny belief that says diversity is good for its own sake and that, if we all hold hands and teach our children the right lessons about celebrating difference, all will be well. Better than well, in fact. The official version is that difference makes us stronger. We have no idea what to do if the opposite turns out to be the case.

Mr. Putnam's work is attracting attention in Britain and the U.S., where, for different reasons, issues of national identity have become urgent. In Britain, the ethnic fissures are so deep that a national debate has begun about what it means to be “British.” In the U.S., many communities are feeling overwhelmed by tides of unassimilated Hispanics. They don't know how to cope. As immigration bills die in Washington, dozens of municipalities and states are passing laws designed to make newcomers feel as unwelcome as possible.

Canada has far higher immigration rates than both the U.S. and Britain. Our hope is that all the newcomers' children will be magically turned into Canadians by the school system, which we rely on as our chief instrument of socialization. Will it work? What's a Canadian, anyway? We have no idea. Meantime, we all go home to our little ethnic enclaves, where we socialize with people like ourselves.

It's possible, of course, that these problems will sort themselves out. Mr. Putnam points out that, only a generation ago, a mixed marriage was when an Irish Catholic married an Italian Catholic. We have adapted relatively quickly to all kinds of profound change. And he says that, even though most measures of a healthy civic society are on the wane, at least two U.S. institutions have proved superb at managing diversity. One is the military, the other the vast new megachurches that have built communities where there were none.

I can't see Canadians embracing either of these entities as role models. So what do we have to offer? Frankly, I'm not confident that having politicians bless Hindu temples, or paying lip service to other people's holidays and gods, will be enough.

Maybe we'll just bumble along and hope time will help create a new “we.” Or maybe we'll evolve into the perfect postmodern state, where there is no “we” but no one cares. Instead, there's only a bunch of interest groups, all pitted against each other to grab what they construe as their fair share of the pie. Kind of like the Canada we have now, only more so.

The study to which Wente points is: E Pluribus Unum: Diversity and Community in the Twenty-first Century - The 2006 Johan Skytte Prize Lecture.  A brief analysis can be found here.

Social capital is not all that easy to understand.  I can offer a neat, tidy, one word definition: trust.  The only problem with that neat, tidy definition is that it misses the essence of the ‘thing.’  As Cummings* points out, “'social capital' has a dark side. Each side in an ethnic conflict is rich in community spirit and social ties. Drug dealers, too, have well-thumbed address-books.”  My preferred model for the role of social capital is the overseas Chinese business ‘networks’ which persist today in all regions where sufficientl protective banking/foreign exchange laws are missing.

Putnam is a wee tiny bit of a ‘one note wonder.’  He has devoted his career (35+ years of it) to the study of social capital and, for the most part, he has been acclaimed by his academic peers – many of them worry about his work (remember ‘The Bell Curve’ debate?) but they understand that it is sound, solid academic analysis.

The problem Putnam illustrates – a problem I think is very real – is that our current official multiculturalism policies – designed, in the main, as a negative, to be unlike the US melting pot, rather than to accomplish anything positive – devalue our national social capital by encouraging formal sub-national groupings which cannot help but:

1. Bring ‘old country’ disputes to their new homelands – putting them in direct conflict with other citizens; and

2. Reduce the trust all people put in society at large by bringing ‘foreign’ conflicts into that society – conflicts which the ‘new’ society finds difficult, even impossible, to resolve.

Putnam has noted that, in the US, the military has been an effective force for building national social capital by creating ties which are stronger than ‘old country’ ethnicity.  Many commentators similarly lauded the US military for helping to lead the way on racial integration in the 1960s and beyond.

In any event: Canada has very weak national, social capital, links.  I’m very sorry, but ‘free’ health care and adolescent anti-Americanism are insufficient, in themselves or taken together, to tie us all together.  If young Canadian Muslims, born, raised and ‘educated’ in Canada, believe that Hezbollah’s leader’s message is right then they will blame Canadian Jews for the plight of Palestinians and they will create an internal, Canadian conflict where none should exist.  Governments, local, provincial and national, will be loath to intervene – lest they be labelled racist or anti-Muslim – and they will, thereby, further reduce the level of trust Canadians have in them.  Repeat this between aboriginals and ‘settlers’ and Croat-Canadians and Serbian-Canadians and ___ - Canadians and non-___ Canadians, over and over again, and the nation is substantially weakened. 


----------
* Dolan Cummings is not, necessarily, a trusted name – see this review of his book and his ‘associations’
 
A good thread!  Definately shows the problems with companies out there that are willing to accept money for advertisement but fail to take responsiblity for the content being displayed.  As per a previous poster, keep Lebanese problems in Lebanon!
 
    I am very frustrated with this billbored . Something like this Billbored  should  not be aloud to be here in Canada  in any shape or form .  I think its great that people  want ot come to Canada to have a better life and I  support that cause.   I think most new comers are honest and just want a better life .   But this billboard attacks everything that is Canadian and I hope that it can be removed quickly.
 
At some point "Canadian values" have to identified to all of us and particularly
new comers.
"Canadian values" have to be imposed somewhat, so that it is possible to get a majority
pulling in the same direction.
A "Canada First" attitude has never been a strong influence in this country,
that's one thing the US has right.

If you are part of an ethno/political group who feels misunderstood, is it possible
you might misunderstand  your place in Canada?
German Canadians have suffered some angst over two world wars and the
holocaust.  They know better than to suggest Hitler was misunderstood.
( Things go badly for those who do )

The Canadian point of view has to be regarded as the right point of view.
The "We are the world" attitude is dangerous cr*p.

That means.......Welcome to Canada ........Please check your baggage at the door.

 
I take it this is not a hoax or rumour?  On that assumption...

I prefer expression to be as unrestricted as possible.  If someone wants to broadcast or distribute fanmail for individuals without explicitly soliciting support for criminal organizations, he should be free to do so.  However, every paid advertiser has (or should have) the freedom of association to decide which transactions to accept.

I want to know whether the content was vetted and posted in full knowledge of exactly what it meant in whichever languages it was written.
 
This is really scary. What happened to Canada? Has anyone got an exact translation of the message?

:cdn:
Hawk
 
Going back to Edward's point about Social Capital; a similar argument has been raised by Samuel Huntington in his book "Who Are We?".

His argument rests on the cohesion brought to America by its first settlers (not "immigrants" by the way), who arrived in cohesive groups with broadly similar ideas, world views and goals, and in sufficient numbers to effectively "shut out" competing ideas for almost 300 years. Even the Roman Catholic Church underwent some drastic mutations in its American form, and many American myths, rituals and civic functions serve to implicitly or explicitly imprint the "American Creed" on all her people.

Judging from both Huntington and a few examples of old American textbooks, schools were indeed the prime socialising element for Americans, and great effort was made, particularly in the first part of the last century (up until immigration was effectively closed off in the mid 1920's) to use universal public education to assimilate everyone. Even private industry spent a great deal of effort in "Americanizing" their work force.

While Canadian history has similar episodes, they are rooted in the Imperial past, with young Canadians being taught "One Flag, One Queen, One Empire", rather than a distinctly Canadian mythology (for want of a better word). Canadian elites moved the nation away from that model (even as it was disintegrating anyway in the aftermath of WWI), but never seem to have come up with anything of their own.

In Huntington's context, our large blocks of unassimilated immigrants are analogous to the settlers rather than immigrants; groups of people with a shared world view and goals who exist in large enough numbers to function and maintain their integrity in the face of the other cultures around them. The fact that their world view and goals are indifferent or even hostile to ours is of no concern to them, unlike the Catholic German immigrants to America in the 17 and 1800's (for example) these settlers in Canada and the United States can effectively function without reference to the surrounding community (many Mexican American Berrios exist where there is no need to speak English; everything from your groceries to the local radio and TV station are in Spanish, and English language media or goods and services would be a curiosity at best.).

Is this billboard a warning shot? Yes it is. Hezbollah already exists and functions in this country, and they are more or less declaring that "our" national political and diplomatic goals are irrelevant even here. You can also expect they will not debate their ideas in any open forum, but simply use shouts of "racism" and "intolerance" in order to silence their opposition.
 
Brad,

Freedoms of speech and association are ideals we strive for.
There are however enemies of these freedoms and of Canada.

Hezbollah is one of those enemies.

I could be accused of saying "freedom to those who agree with me".

I see the problem.  What is said in a public forum needs to be qualified.
There do need to be standards.

Yea, this is thorny.






 
Flip said:
Hezbollah is one of those enemies.

Indeed they are, does not the outlawing of them as a terr org attest to that?  Furthermore in this test of Canada's mettle our fear of
shouts of "racism" and "intolerance" in order to silence their opposition.
only exposes a weakness according to their feudal and subjugating mindset; for these barbarians will only respect the iron fist, not the voices of secular reason.  And that perceived weakness in effect gives them a license to
declaring that "our" national political and diplomatic goals are irrelevant even here.
 

Now is the time to draw the line.  We do that around the world, let's do  it at home.
 
Is there anybody around with enough legal knowledge to find out if this breaks any outright laws?  I'm searching now, but not turning up much specific.
 
It was replaced first thing this morning with a car dealership ad. Don't know who made the decision, or on what basis, but it's gone. And that's the main thing.
 
A bit of the REST of the story (if you believe MSM), shared with the usual disclaimers....

Billboard depicting Hezbollah's controversial leader removed
CanWest News Service, 13 Aug 07
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=5cd07f1e-efaa-4009-a5c6-6468c9938da3&k=53710

The billboard depicting Hezbollah's controversial leader, which caused an uproar across Windsor, was quietly replaced Monday morning with an advertisement for a car dealership.

The sign was erected Friday morning and immediately drew fire from the Windsor Jewish Community Centre and the Lebanese Christian political group Kataeb.

Among other Lebanese leaders, the sign prominently depicted Hassan Nasrallah, the head of the political and military group representing Shia Muslims.

Hezbollah, considered a terrorist organization by Ottawa, was created in 1982 primarily to resist the Israeli occupation of Lebanon that lasted two decades.

One of the sign's opponents, Harvey Kessler, executive director of the Windsor Jewish Community Centre, said the sign was "the opposite of peace."

Hussein Dabaja, one of the people who came up with idea for the billboard, said it was meant to honour friends and family who have died fighting in Lebanon.

Mr. Dabaja said he's one of a number of local Lebanese community members who had the idea about seven months ago, after discussing other options to honour people back home that included a candle light vigil.

He said community members and leaders of organizations representing about 700 people settled on the billboard plan.
 
milnewstbay said:
Hussein Dabaja, one of the people who came up with idea for the billboard, said it was meant to honour friends and family who have died fighting in Lebanon.

Ahhh, I see, it was for some righteous dudes! Shit, put it back up then!
 
Funny, the National left out some key parts of the story that we got:

http://www.canada.com/windsorstar/story.html?id=0ec6495d-198b-4d4c-a0b4-cce97395fd27&k=42486

Billboard disappears

'We don't need that kind of discord,' councillor says
Trevor Wilhelm, Windsor Star
Published: Monday, August 13, 2007

The controversial billboard depicting Hezbollah's leader had disappeared Monday morning, but one of the men responsible for the sign says it's not because they're backing down from fierce public backlash.

"What ever we believe, we'll speak about it anytime," said Hussein Dabaja. "We will speak about human rights, about the truth, about Nasrallah. We're going to do it and nobody can stop us. We'll talk about it anywhere, any place we have a chance."

Dabaja said the company that owns the sign, CBS Outdoors, covered the billboard because the Lebanese community members only paid to have it up over the weekend.

Dabaja said the company that owns the sign, CBS Outdoors, covered the billboard because the Lebanese community members only paid to have it up over the weekend.

The billboard depicting Hezbollah's controversial leader (top photo) was quietly replaced Monday morning with an advertisement for a car dealership (bottom photo).

"We paid for the weekend and it's done," said Dabaja. "We have our message, and our message got the point across."

CBS Outdoor didn't return phone calls on Monday.

The billboard depicting Hezbollah's leader Hassan Nasrallah was quietly replaced Monday morning with an advertisement for a car dealership.

The sign was erected Friday morning at the corner Wyandotte Street and Marion Avenue, and immediately drew fire from the Windsor Jewish Community Centre, the Lebanese Christian political group Kataeb and others.

Among other Lebanese leaders, the sign prominently depicts  the head of the political and military group representing Shia Muslims. Hezbollah, considered a terrorist organization by the Canadian government, was created in 1982 primarily to resist the Israeli occupation of Lebanon that lasted two decades.

Dabaja said it was meant to honour friends and family who have died fighting in Lebanon.

Harvey Kessler, executive director of the Windsor Jewish Community Centre, said the sign was "the opposite of peace" and a message from terrorists.

"I'm pleased it is down," said Kessler. "Hopefully, it leads to a discussion about the kind of community we want to live in. Also in the Lebanon and Arab communities, they need to talk about these issues as well, and the kind of community, the kind of Canada we live in. I hope it will generate a lot of discussion and some positive outcome."

Alan Halberstadt, city councillor for Ward 3 where the sign went up, said it was "hard to say" whether those responsible for the sign should have the right ot put it up.

"Certainly, the Canadian government has indicated they define Hezbollah as a terrorist organization," said Halberstadt. "That would certainly lend a lot of weight to not displaying that sort of thing."

He did say it's probably a good thing that the sign is gone.

"Perhaps it is a good thing it is down, because it caused such a discord in Windsor," said Halberstadt. "We don't need that kind of discord."


Yeah, I bet the message got the point across.  However, I imagine the message that was intended was not meant for anything close to what was said by Mr. Welcome-to-Focused-Attention Dabaja.  That sort of defiant tone can't really be mistaken for anything other than what it is; the opening salvo of an ongoing campaign. 
 
Our Mr. Hussein Dabaja  :rage:
23855-8427.jpg
 
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