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Toronto Mayor Rob Ford

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He didn't exactly let them ask questions either...

Link to the latest  http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/mayor-rob-ford-yes-i-have-smoked-crack-cocaine-1.2415533

And Doug Ford calling on the police chief to step down  ::)

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/doug-ford-calls-on-toronto-police-chief-to-step-down-1.2415154

Toronto is in quite the mess.
 
Crantor said:
He didn't exactly let them ask questions either...

Link to the latest  http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/mayor-rob-ford-yes-i-have-smoked-crack-cocaine-1.2415533

And Doug Ford calling on the police chief to step down  ::)

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/doug-ford-calls-on-toronto-police-chief-to-step-down-1.2415154

Toronto is in quite the mess.

This guys is just a sideshow, albeit a very funny one, at least I find him funny  ;D

I know old Stephen is probably pretty happy Mayor Rob is around because he is taking away all the attention from the Senate Scandal  ;D

DEA3891sq.jpg
 
He certainly featured on Jon Stewart's The Daily Show last night.  :rofl:


Edit: changed website, since the US one doesn't work here.....something about us having free health care  ;)
 
Well that final thread of support has snapped, have fun Rob.

Crantor said:
And Doug Ford calling on the police chief to step down  ::)

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/doug-ford-calls-on-toronto-police-chief-to-step-down-1.2415154

Toronto is in quite the mess.

Doug Ford isn't the only one, the former solicitor general is suggest Blair crossed a line he should not have
http://www.torontosun.com/2013/11/04/blair-may-have-overstepped-his-authority-senator

"A Canadian senator and former solicitor general of Ontario is among several justice system veterans saying Chief Bill Blair may have overstepped his authority by saying he was “disappointed” over the Mayor Rob Ford’s alleged crack video.

And Conservative Senator Bob Runciman said he is also concerned about details released from court documents on surveillance that didn’t allow for basic human dignity.

“I can’t recall anything like his (press) conference and his unnecessary comments ... the video and his disappointment,” Runciman said Monday.

Blair last Thursday told reporters: “I think it’s fair to say that the mayor does appear in that video but I’m not going to get into the detail of what activity is depicted on that video.” He also commented that “as a citizen of Toronto, I’m disappointed” and said “this is a traumatic issue for the citizens of this city and for the reputation of this city and that concerns me.”

Runciman, who was Ontario’s top cop from 1995-99 in the Mike Harris government, said he has no comment on Ford or his alleged activities.

But the chief’s comments, he said, must be addressed.

In Ontario’s Police Services Act, it states when it comes to engaging in “political rights,” a police officer while in uniform must not engage in “political activity that places, or is likely to place, the police officer in a position of conflict of interest.”

The Toronto Police Services Board regulations say an officer on duty is not to “express views on any issue not directly related to the police officer’s responsibilities as a police officer.”

Expressing his disappointment and speaking of a “traumatic issue” for the “reputation of the city,” is what shocked Runciman. He also expressed surprise over the “release of police notes and photo (of) mayor urinating” — the latter was taken by a spy plane.

“The public should know the tax dollars spent on this, plus justification for the same,” he said. “There is a serious issue here of use of scarce police resources and the chief should be required to explain and justify.”

Other leaders agree.

A senior member of Prime Minister Stephen Harper’s caucus said it was “shocking to see a chief of police use that choice of words toward someone who has not been charged but who may be under investigation.”

And former British Columbia premier Ujjal Dosanjh tweeted “by saying what evidence he has against Ford Blair entered political arena. Charge, put up or shut up. That’s the rule for non-political police.”

He also tweeted “Ford is a nincompoop. Chief Blair wrong to give particulars of evidence against a politician and not disclose fully” and “can’t have evidence and not produce.”

It is not the first time Blair has been criticized over video evidence. In 2010, there was Blair’s apology to Adam Nobody after his mistaken premise the video that captured a police assault on an “armed” man was “tampered” with.

Blair, nor spokesman Mark Pugash, returned an e-mail listing a series of questions surrounding his comments and other aspects of the story including oaths to secrecy, privacy, presumption of innocence, whether an outside service should be brought in and the cost of surveilling the mayor?

TPSB Chair Dr. Alok Mukherjee has yet to respond if there would be a probe. Mayor Ford’s lawyer Dennis Morris also declined to comment.

But earlier, the mayor and Councillor Doug Ford alluded to concerns of a political conspiracy and “witch-hunt” to have him removed from office.

Meanwhile, those close to Ford say an organizer of the upcoming chief’s gala suggested “it would be best that Mr. Ford not attend.”

If it was a private party it would be the chief’s choice to decide who he invites but one Ford loyalist said this time it was the mayor who was “disappointed” since he wanted to support the frontline officers and help the chief raise money for victims’ services.

Needless to say it’s a dysfunctional relationship but the mayor has vowed he will not be uninvited to the upcoming budget process and that the chief will have to deal with him on future police spending. The budgeting for surveillance money will be an interesting conversation in which one wonders whether both will be in conflict.

Runciman said there are questions even bigger that should be considered.

“If police resources were used for political purposes, that should alarm everyone, including Ford haters,” said the senator."

I happen to agree with Runciman.
 
Journeyman said:
He certainly featured on Jon Stewart's The Daily Show last night.  :rofl:


Edit: changed website, since the US one doesn't work here.....something about us having free health care  ;)

Hahahaha I just watched it.... Rob Ford and his "Crackstituents"
 
http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2013/11/05/rob_ford_yes_i_have_smoked_crack_cocaine.html


Rob Ford : 'Yes, I have smoked crack cocaine.'
Rob Ford said he smoked crack about a year ago. “I don’t even remember. Probably in one of my drunken stupors.”
“Yes, I have smoked crack cocaine,” Mayor Rob Ford admitted at a surprise news conference just after noon.
“I am not an addict,” he told the stunned media.
“ I wasn’t lying . You didn’t ask the correct questions,” Ford explained to why the admission was so long in coming.
“You guys kept referring to alcohol,” he told the media.
“I want everybody in the city to see this tape. I don’t even recall there being a tape. I want to see the state I was in.
“No, I don’t do drugs.”
Ford said he smoked crack about a year ago. “I don’t even remember. Probably in one of my drunken stupors. You guys have seen the state I’ve been in.”
The admission comes six months after Ford said at a May 24 news conference, “I do not use crack cocaine. Nor am I an addict of crack cocaine.”
Since that May news conference, Ford has said many times he does not use crack.
The news conference came a week after two Star reporters disclosed that they had seen a clear video of Mayor Ford smoking what appeared to be crack from a glass pipe, calling Justin Trudeau, now Liberal leader, a “fag” and his high school football players “f------ minorities.”
At that news conference, Ford said he would not comment on a video “that I have never seen or does not exist.”
It was only last Thursday that Toronto police Chief Bill Blair confirmed the video does exist and it does show what the Star’s Kevin Donovan and Robyn Doolittle reported.
Blair’s news conference followed release of half a police document about months of surveillance of Ford and alleged drug dealer Alexander “Sandro” Lisi.
Lisi was charged Oct. 1 with drug charges and on Thursday with extortion related to “threats” to recover the video.
Ford said he’s been advised by his lawyer, Dennis Morris, not to talk to police.
“You ask the question properly, I’ll answer it,” Ford told the media. Yes, I’ve made mistakes. All I can do now is apologize and move on.
“That’s why I want to see the tape. I want everyone in the city to see this tape. I’d like to see this tape. I don’t even recall there being a tape or a video and I know that, so I want to see the state that I was in. I don’t know what else I can say.
“I made mistakes in the past and all I can do is apologize, but it is what it is. And I can’t change the past and I can apologize to my family, my friends, my colleagues and the people of this great city.”
Ford’s apology echoed his comments on his Sunday radio show with his brother, Councillor Doug Ford, that he made mistakes.
“The Danforth, that was pure stupidity. I shouldn’t have got hammered down at the Danforth,” he said.
A drunken St. Patrick’s Day 2012, he said, was things getting “a little out of control.”
Ford refused to resign on Thursday at a 64-second news conference and again on Monday.
 
Hatchet Man said:
Yup that plays out on my FB wall all the time, people being critical about him allegedly using a crack pipe, while simultaneously extol the virtues of safe injection sites....of course those SI shouldn't be in THIER neighbourhoods.  I am actually quite sick of all the hypocrisy, and started taking a page from Tucker Max, I am calling you out on your blantant double standards, and frankly could care less if these acquaintances think I am an a-hole, and unfriend me.  I have told them as much I don't care, even to people I have known for years.  There really is no hair splitting when it comes to drug use with me.

Do you also know soldiers who have used prostitutes? I know a few. Did you know that many prostitutes use drugs. They often contract hepatitis or AIDS from crack pipes and reusing needles. They then infect John's who then infect their partners. If a soldier and possibly his wife is taken out by Hep that costs Canada craploads of money. SI/free crack pipes is about saving money and protecting citizens from disease. Citizens like your fellow soldiers. It is not about helping the addicts. Their primary function is preventing the spread of disease. I don't see how the two are equivalent.
 
Nemo888 said:
Do you also know soldiers who have used prostitutes? I know a few. Did you know that many prostitutes use drugs. They often contract hepatitis or AIDS from crack pipes and reusing needles. They then infect John's who then infect their partners. If a soldier and possibly his wife is taken out by Hep that costs Canada craploads of money. SI/free crack pipes is about saving money and protecting citizens from disease. Citizens like your fellow soldiers. It is not about helping the addicts. Their primary function is preventing the spread of disease. I don't see how the two are equivalent.

If you don't use protection regardless of who you sleep with, that's a personal issue.  As for you claims, either put up the hard data, or STFU.  Anything that just allows people to continue to partake in illegal activities and thereby fund criminals and terrorists, is not something that should be supported by taxpayers.
 
Hatchet Man said:
.....either put up the hard data, or STFU.
Some people have a pretty solid reputation for posting their conspiracy theories, masquerading as fact. 
Sometimes those people languish on the ignore list; sometimes the Mods get fed up and ban them. 

:dunno:  luck of the draw
 
Journeyman said:
Some people have a pretty solid reputation for posting their conspiracy theories, masquerading as fact. 
Sometimes those people languish on the ignore list; sometimes the Mods get fed up and ban them. 

:dunno:  luck of the draw

Ignore list....good call....Nemo888 added.
 
Nemo, either back up your claims or stop posting here.

Simple.

This should require no further explanation.
 
You guys live in a weird little bubble. I have worked in medical care for a long time and have seen first hand spouses infected by partners who were infected by sex industry workers. Germs don't care about your moral code. The STD rate among unlicensed sex workers has always been high. Their clients are a vector between high risk and low risk groups. Stopping the infection at the source is always more effective than cleaning up the mess further down the line.
http://jid.oxfordjournals.org/content/174/Supplement_2/S134.full.pdf

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19015565 Stopping needle sharing alone saves millions while preventing regular productive citizens from contracting STD's is of much greater value.

"Focusing on the base assumption of decreased needle sharing as the only effect of the supervised injection facility, we found that the facility was associated with an incremental net savings of almost $14 million and 920 life-years gained over 10 years. When we also considered the health effect of increased use of safe injection practices, the incremental net savings increased to more than $20 million and the number of life-years gained to 1070. Further increases were estimated when we considered all 3 health benefits: the incremental net savings was more than $18 million and the number of life-years gained 1175. Results were sensitive to assumptions related to injection frequency, the risk of HIV transmission through needle sharing, the frequency of safe injection practices among users of the facility, the costs of HIV-related care and of operating the facility, and the proportion of users who inject in the facility.
 
Nemo888 said:
Do you also know soldiers who have used prostitutes? I know a few. Did you know that many prostitutes use drugs. They often contract hepatitis or AIDS from crack pipes and reusing needles. They then infect John's who then infect their partners. If a soldier and possibly his wife is taken out by Hep that costs Canada craploads of money. SI/free crack pipes is about saving money and protecting citizens from disease. Citizens like your fellow soldiers. It is not about helping the addicts. Their primary function is preventing the spread of disease. I don't see how the two are equivalent.

You don't get HIV (I am assuming that is what you meant when you wrote AIDS) from smoking from a crack pipe LOL ... you can get Hepatitis C but jesus if you are going to start making statements at least get the terminology right  ::)
 
Nemo888 said:
You guys live in a weird little bubble.

Yes, pardon me, you're the only one in step. Again. Go easy on us, please.

You want to post here? Then back up what you post and generally keep to the guidelines. It ain't rocket appliances. No, I won't break that down further or you. You're fast becoming an admin burden what with all the splainin I have to do of some pretty low curb stuff.
 
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/ahc-asc/pubs/_sites-lieux/insite/index-eng.php#insite

In addition to providing clean needles to prevent transmission of disease, the safe injection sits also provide counseling and other health services.

Generally not really sure how I feel about them one way or another, but as the war on drugs clearly isn't working, alternate approaches likes these seem worth a shot. 

This is a little off topic in any case, not sure this has to do with safe injection sites.  The issue with Rob Ford is that he's the mayor of the city while wandering around 'in drunken stupors' smoking crack with gangbangers.  That's a stunning display of poor judgement for the guy that's supposed to be leading the city.
 
Navy_Pete said:
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/ahc-asc/pubs/_sites-lieux/insite/index-eng.php#insite

In addition to providing clean needles to prevent transmission of disease, the safe injection sits also provide counseling and other health services.

Generally not really sure how I feel about them one way or another, but as the war on drugs clearly isn't working, alternate approaches likes these seem worth a shot. 

Within the report

On reducing bloodborne diseases
Limitations of research

There is no direct evidence that SISs reduce rates of HIV infection, and the mathematical models used are based on assumption that may not be valid.
Baseline rates of needle sharing have not been reported for SIS users.
Self-reports of changes in needle sharing beyond the walls of SISs have not been validated.
More objective evidence of sustained changes in risk behaviours and a comparison or control group study would be needed to confidently state that SISs have a significant impact on these behaviours.


On reducting Crime
Limitations of research

The limitations that go with the findings of the Boyd et al. (2008) research, as pointed out by the researchers themselves, are those that must always go with using reported and official crime statistics. Specifically, violent and property crime statistics do not account for unreported victimization and public tolerance, or the extent to which that might have changed over the period under study. Further, we do not know the extent to which non-reporting of crime and public tolerance is any higher for the population living in and around the INSITE facility and in the Downtown Eastside, than it might be for the City of Vancouver overall.
We also need to be extremely skeptical of drug crime statistics as they are driven by continually changing enforcement capacity and practices. Further, for the most part these crimes, like other so-called victimless crimes, are almost never reported by anyone other than the police. With this in mind, it is perhaps safest to assume that drug crime statistics tell us very little about the nature and extent of drug crime anywhere.


On limited OD's fatalites
Limitations of research

There is no direct evidence that SIS influence overdose death rates and large scale and long-term, case-controlled studiesFootnote 8 would be needed to show that SISs influence overdose death rates among those who use INSITE. Mathematical modelling is based on assumptions that may not be valid.


Discarded needles in public
Limitations of research

For the INSITE service the objective evidence concerning littering obtained for only a short period of time before and after the service opened.
Research has not controlled for other factors that may influence littering and loitering (weather, police activity, availability of drugs, availability of syringe drop-off boxes and clean-up campaignsFootnote 9)
It may be unrealistic to expect the INSITE service to have a major impact on publicly discarded syringes because most injections that take place in the Downtown Eastside do not take place at INSITE.


So basically some of the biggest reason's why people say these facilities are necessary, haven't borne any hard evidence to support their claim(s).  The research is full of gaping holes, and based on assumptions.

This is a little off topic in any case, not sure this has to do with safe injection sites.  The issue with Rob Ford is that he's the mayor of the city while wandering around 'in drunken stupors' smoking crack with gangbangers.  That's a stunning display of poor judgement for the guy that's supposed to be leading the city.

Quite a few media outlets and people that are looking to publicly lynch the guy because of his now admitted drug use (and the resultant criminality that it is connected to), are quite ardent supporters of SI's, which is basically akin to sucking and blowing at the same time.  Drug use is bad is situation A, but not bad in situation B?  It is hypocrisy at it's finest.  And as I have brought up repeatedly as an addendum to this SI thing/tacit support of drug use(rs) is again, many supported George Smitherman in becoming mayor and decided his past drug use and less the honest admission of said use, was not an impediment to him holding office, now want Ford to go because of his less than honest admission of drug use.  The star, g&m were ready to crown Simtherman mayor despite an admission to being ADDICTED to something for at least 5 YEARS (and providing no further details himself, and they didn't bother to get any).  How can they and others with a straight face now demand Ford step aside (and I am not condoning his use, merely pointing out the ridiculousness of their position), because he hit the pipe one time?

This hairsplitting on when it is acceptable and when it is not is ludicrous.
 
Well, well, well...

"You didn't ask me the right question"

So, let me get this right. The onus for telling the truth doesn't lie on an individual who knows that truth, it lies on the person asking him questions? Really?

Doesn't that sound just a touch disingenuous?

To me this takes us back to what has always been the major concern: the crack pipe video being IMHO an interesting but somewhat secondary issue. Just another demonstration in a very long string of demonstrations of every kind, of unsuitability for a leadership position, including apparent disregard for the advice from people around him. (Most recently, it seems, even from from Brother Doug, who didn't look too happy about this turn of events and its splashback on his own credibility)

It's strange (but instructive and quite consistent...) to see that the same Mayor who a little while ago was howling for the sacking of a lowly City employee (allegedly) caught sleeping on the job, doesn't want the same standards of strictness  and vengeance applied to him.

Not to mention anybody in Toronto that the Toronto police may want to question voluntarily  in the future: the example from His Worship is "lawyer up and don't talk".  I'm sure that the police already find this kind of behaviour depressingly familiar.
 
pbi said:
Well, well, well...

"You didn't ask me the right question"

So, let me get this right. The onus for telling the truth doesn't lie on an individual who knows that truth, it lies on the person asking him questions? Really?

Doesn't that sound just a touch disingenuous?

It is disingenuous and doesn't help his case, but as Christie Blatchford wrote about yesterday (and the legions of bleeding hearts who usually support people with substance abuse issues) people dealing with issues, tend to be deceitful and less than honest.  He has already shown a history of not wanting to admit his errors, so how this is shocking is a mystery to me.

To me this takes us back to what has always been the major concern: the crack pipe video being IMHO an interesting but somewhat secondary issue. Just another demonstration in a very long string of demonstrations of every kind, of unsuitability for a leadership position, including apparent disregard for the advice from people around him. (Most recently, it seems, even from from Brother Doug, who didn't look too happy about this turn of events and its splashback on his own credibility)

Toronto seems to have no issue voting in liars, after all they kept McGuinty in power after he lied blatantly on several instances.
It's strange (but instructive and quite consistent...) to see that the same Mayor who a little while ago was howling for the sacking of a lowly City employee (allegedly) caught sleeping on the job, doesn't want the same standards of strictness  and vengeance applied to him.

Do as I say, not as I do.

Not to mention anybody in Toronto that the Toronto police may want to question voluntarily  in the future: the example from His Worship is "lawyer up and don't talk".  I'm sure that the police already find this kind of behaviour depressingly familiar.

That's stretching it.  And last I checked in our system of government and law order, he is well within his rights (as in anybody) to do so.  Canada is not a police state (despite what some claim) and person is under no obligation to talk to police without legal counsel, no matter how much it frustrates the police.
 
;D

Leave it to the SUN to come up with something 'interesting':
http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/home.html
SUN POLL

Both Toronto Mayor Rob Ford and Liberal Leader Justin Trudeau have admitted to using illegal drugs while in elected office.
Should both politicians be held to the same standard?
 

Yes
No
 
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