CMMA - replacing the CP140 Aurora

[SeaKingTacco]

I hadn’t followed that saga but was it because Bell already had something to show, as opposed to Bombardier during CMMA?

Oh no. Straight up (semi-legal, shadowy) lobbying of a Minister, who made a decision without checking with his DM, the CDS, the PM or Cabinet. Pretty ballsy, I have to admit.

He also decreed that only genuine Quebec Maple Syrup would be served in CAF dining facilities. No pancake syrup was allowed. I am not making this up.

 

[dimsum]

Oh no. Straight up (semi-legal, shadowy) lobbying of a Minister, who made a decision without checking with his DM, the CDS, the PM or Cabinet. Pretty ballsy, I have to admit.

He also decreed that only genuine Quebec Maple Syrup would be served in CAF dining facilities. No pancake syrup was allowed. I am not making this up.

Canadian corruption - This Hour Has 22 Minutes style

 

[Maxman1]

As I understood, the 412 being built in Quebec and the then-current Twin Huey being built in Texas played a part.

 

[FSTO]

Masse was an old school politician; “My Constituents, My Province, Me” and not necessarily in that order.

 

[KevinB]

As I understood, the 412 being built in Quebec and the then-current Twin Huey being built in Texas played a part.

The fact that the 412 don’t make the downselect due to not making the requirements and the UH-60 was about to be announced didn’t bother him at all.

 

[Retired AF Guy]

Oh no. Straight up (semi-legal, shadowy) lobbying of a Minister, who made a decision without checking with his DM, the CDS, the PM or Cabinet. Pretty ballsy, I have to admit.

He also decreed that only genuine Quebec Maple Syrup would be served in CAF dining facilities. No pancake syrup was allowed. I am not making this up.

Is this Marcel Masse you are referring too? I was thinking Chrétien..

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Is this Marcel Masse you are referring too? I was thinking Chrétien..

Masse. Under Mulroney.

 

[GK .Dundas]

As I recall at the time there were funds that a Minister could tap into without cabinet approval. Say for example you had to make emergency purchases.
Needless to say the cash limits to those discretionary purchasing powers have reduced considerably.

 

[Good2Golf]

The requirements aren’t set by the GoC - they’re set by the Project office.

Pesky requirements can be ignored on Ministerial Whim. Ask Marcel Masse….

Yup!

On April 29, 1992, I had a front row seat to the shenanigans…it went down exactly as SKT said.

I called friends in the PMO after I landed back in Ottawa and told them what just went down. To quote one of them, “F*ck off, that doesn’t even meet spec!” I laughed a knowing, but sad laugh, and believe I replied, “Wait for it…”

 

[DBNSG]

View attachment 82454


Yup!

On April 29, 1992, I had a front row seat to the shenanigans…it went down exactly as SKT said.

I called friends in the PMO after I landed back in Ottawa and told them what just went down. To quote one of them, “F*ck off, that doesn’t even meet spec!” I laughed a knowing, but sad laugh, and believe I replied, “Wait for it…”

View attachment 82453

Just to start the week off correctly what was the wouda, couda, shouda supposed to be other than the Griffins?

 

[dimsum]

Just to start the week off correctly what was the wouda, couda, shouda supposed to be other than the Griffins?

To put this tangent in the CH-146 Griffon thread?

CH-146 Griffon

There was an article yesterday about the UK MoD downsizing the A400 fleet due to excessive cost overruns. Not sure the number 22 holds at this point. Some rumours of extending the Herc fleet as well?

army.ca

 

[OldSolduer]

Mulroney.

Who also gave huge contract to a company in PQ, and completely fucked off Bristol Aerospace IIRC.

 

[GK .Dundas]

I always got the feeling that Masse blindsided both the PMO and Cabinet with this purchase.
And there wasn't much they could do about it because of how sensitive relations were with Quebec..
There were all sorts of odd thing that happened during that time period under Minister Masse.
Equipment movements, purchases .
I suspect that you write an interesting book on that period.

 

[Good2Golf]

Just to start the week off correctly what was the wouda, couda, shouda supposed to be other than the Griffins?

UH-60 Black Hawk…53 of them…50 as 1:1 replacements for the CH135 Twin Hueys plus 3 for the flight in Ottawa supporting the RCMP SERT.

 

[Good2Golf]

I always got the feeling that Masse blindsided both the PMO and Cabinet with this purchase.
And there wasn't much they could do about it because of how sensitive relations were with Quebec..
There were all sorts of odd thing that happened during that time period under Minister Masse.
Equipment movements, purchases .
I suspect that you write an interesting book on that period.

I didn’t have that feeling at all…and I asked him straight up. PM and PMO (the PM’s one, not the CFUTTH PMO) supported Masse.

 

[DBNSG]

UH-60 Black Hawk…53 of them…50 as 1:1 replacements for the CH135 Twin Hueys plus 3 for the flight in Ottawa supporting the RCMP SERT.

Thanks

 

[FSTO]

Who also gave huge contract to a company in PQ, and completely fucked off Bristol Aerospace IIRC.

Cf 18 Maintenance Contract was the sire of the Reform Party movement.

 

[Good2Golf]

To put this tangent in the CH-146 Griffon thread?

CH-146 Griffon

There was an article yesterday about the UK MoD downsizing the A400 fleet due to excessive cost overruns. Not sure the number 22 holds at this point. Some rumours of extending the Herc fleet as well?

army.ca

That thread’s for light blue scarves and gloves….and hotel Yelp ratings.

 

[GK .Dundas]

Thank you for the rest of the story and correcting my ignorance.

 

[RangerRay]

Who also gave huge contract to a company in PQ, and completely fucked off Bristol Aerospace IIRC.

And gave us the LSVW. Thanks.