Aerospace Control Officers-AEC [merged]

[Air4ce]

Mountie, I just checked your posting history. In most instances where you offered an opinion or information about AEC you have been wrong, just as you are here. That you think you can offer meaningful insight into traffic levels as an untrained AEC is truly puzzling. I get that you are trying to be helpful but you really need to offer input only if you are sure it is the right information and hopefuly information based on experience.

In fact there are three airframe types in Moose Jaw (Tutor, Harvard and Hawk) and they all operate with quite different performance characteristics. Throw in that it is a training environment and the myriad of approaches that must be practiced, Moose Jaw is indeed very complex.

Aerospaced_out,

And what vast ATC experience do you have that qualifies you to be such an expert on what constitutes complex traffic.  Moose Jaw is NOT "indeed very complex".  Yes it is extremely busy and therefore very challenging, but the three aircraft types you mention all have very similar performance characteristics.  Try controlling at a Wing that has jets, multi-engine, helicopters, light civies, gliders and SAR Techs, then you can talk about what complexity is.  In case you are wondering, I have controlled at Moose Jaw, Goose Bay, Greenwood, Comox and three exercises, MARCOT, NATOAir Meet and Maple Guardian.

 

[johnnyhangover]

you don't make friends easily, do you?

 

[johnnyhangover]

Hi all,

I am married with a kid and I am graduating from university next april after which I will be starting on AEC training.  From what I gather from the very helpful info that has been posted, I can expect to spend next summer at a wing, then 10-18 weeks in cornhole, er, cornwall; followed by 4-6 months at a wing for ojt.

my question(s) is this:

1.  did i get the above info right?

2.  Will my family be allowed to move with me for those 4-6 months of ojt, or do they have to wait until I get posted after that period?

thanks in advance!

 

[PMedMoe]

1.  did i get the above info right?

2.  Will my family be allowed to move with me for those 4-6 months of ojt, or do they have to wait until I get posted after that period?

thanks in advance!

1.  Not sure.

2.  If it's a posting, your family can go.  If not, they can go but you will pay for it yourself.

 

[Aerospaced_out]

Aerospaced_out,

And what vast ATC experience do you have that qualifies you to be such an expert on what constitutes complex traffic.  Moose Jaw is NOT "indeed very complex".  Yes it is extremely busy and therefore very challenging, but the three aircraft types you mention all have very similar performance characteristics.  Try controlling at a Wing that has jets, multi-engine, helicopters, light civies, gliders and SAR Techs, then you can talk about what complexity is.  In case you are wondering, I have controlled at Moose Jaw, Goose Bay, Greenwood, Comox and three exercises, MARCOT, NATOAir Meet and Maple Guardian.

I have controlled at Goose Bay and Cold Lake, as well as a few other places, all of them as both a Tower and IFR controller. I have been the WOpsO/WATCO in Moose Jaw. Currently I am the Cmdt of CFSACO. That meet your standards?

Moose Jaw is more complex that YAW, YBG, YZX, YTR and for most of the year more complex than YOD and on many a day at least as complex at YQQ. Moreover, if the Harvard and Hawk have such similar performance characteristics why are the seperated onto the Inner and Outer runway? Throw in the Snowbirds and you have a recipe for complex ops on a daily basis both IFR and VFR. It's not the same as the Tutor days, whch given your response is likely the last time you controlled there.


@ johnnyhangover : Once you leave university you are normally prohibited posted to a wing for OJT while you wait your course. If the wait is to be too long they will actually give you a full posting. Mind you the turnover rate has been short enough so far that we aren't seeing candidates get full postings. Once you graduate you will be sent to a unit to qualify. This is usually accompanied by a full posting where you family can move at the Crown's expense. Efforts are made by Air Force Training to keep families together or nearby while in the training system but you might have to spend some time away during this training phase of your career.

 

[Air4ce]

I have controlled at Goose Bay and Cold Lake, as well as a few other places, all of them as both a Tower and IFR controller. I have been the WOpsO/WATCO in Moose Jaw. Currently I am the Cmdt of CFSACO. That meet your standards?

Well hello neighbour (Goose Bay).  Sorry about the tree.  Now you should know who I am as well.

Ya, now that I know who you are I would say you've met my standards.  And here I thought you were just another AEC wannabe picking on another equally inexperienced wannabe.  I guess this shows you how decieving the internet can be.  I still don't agree with your assessment of Moose Jaw's traffic, but I'm sure we can discuss this in person the next time our paths cross.  Hopefully in a mess somewhere and not in your office.

Rob

 

[Aerospaced_out]

I knew who you were before I posted the reply... only one wanker I know that did YMJ, YYR and AETE. Moreover, only someone controlling in YQQ would think Moose Jaw is not complex

 

[johnnyhangover]

1.  Not sure.

2.  If it's a posting, your family can go.  If not, they can go but you will pay for it yourself.

wow.  what useful information.  you really shed light on it for me. :

 

[PMedMoe]

wow.  what useful information.  you really shed light on it for me. :

Don't like the answer?  Don't read it.  There are others here that are more detailed.

 

[George Wallace]

wow.  what useful information.  you really shed light on it for me. :

At the same time, you are shedding some light on who you are, to us. 

 

[PMedMoe]

At the same time, you are shedding some light on who you are, to us.

The user name did it for me.  Appears it was a "drive by" posting:

Last Active: Today at 08:15:25

 

[johnnyhangover]

Don't like the answer?  Don't read it.  There are others here that are more detailed.

how silly.

how am i to determine my affinity for your answer if i don't read it?

i guess i was hoping for a response from aerospaced_out, as he/she seems to only post when actually having something to say.

 

[George Wallace]

:

how silly.

how am i to determine my affinity for your answer if i don't read it?

i guess i was hoping for a response from Aerospaced_out, as he/she seems to only post when actually having something to say.

Like I said......You are showing us who you are.  Apparently you don't pay any attention to what you post:

1.  Not sure.

2.  If it's a posting, your family can go.  If not, they can go but you will pay for it yourself.

wow.  what useful information.  you really shed light on it for me. :

So get over yourself, and pay attention to the information people are kind enough to give you.  You don't need special treatment, do you?  Do you really need Aerospaced_out to answer your question? 

As for having something to say; please practice what you preach.

Thanks for coming out.

 

[Grando]

To touch on a topic mentioned earlier in this thread - is VFR still open to newbies as a first course?  I'm not interested at all, but there've been back and forths about whether it was officially closed to new ATCs.

Similarly, is the January IFR course full yet?

 

[Aerospaced_out]

To touch on a topic mentioned earlier in this thread - is VFR still open to newbies as a first course?  I'm not interested at all, but there've been back and forths about whether it was officially closed to new ATCs.

Similarly, is the January IFR course full yet?

VFR is open to newbies (aka... ab initio). In fact most VFR students are ab initio just as it is with the other two streams.
Jan 2010 IFR is full at this time but if augmentation is found to replace an instructor proceeding on maternity leave then three more slots will open up. I won't predict the likelihood of that happening given this will be during OP PODIUM (olympics).

 

[Grando]

Thank you for the information sir.  It's very much appreciated.  I do have one last query about the Jan 2010 VFR course - and whether there are spots remaining.

 

[AEC@34]

Aerospaced_out could you please provide us with master training schedule for 2010 for AEC in zip/excel file.  thanks in advance.

 

[Aerospaced_out]

There is an earlier version in this thread as an attachment. While it is for 2009 the template will be the same for 2010. Dates will only change by a few days. If you have access to the DIN the latest is on the CFSACO website. Otherwise you will have to wait til I get back from leave.

cheers...

 

[AEC@34]

Cool, i have the 2009 file, happy holidays :nod:

 

[Aerospaced_out]

Attached is the latest CFSACO Master Schedule (dated 16 JUl 2009).
Schedules are living documents and not written in stone.