Mess Dress

[Recce41]

John
Nice mess, damn nicer than the old one. Might try to drop by if in town.

 

[Sailing Instructor]

The CF dress instructions contain this information.  Although I suppose what with all the nuances of each army unit's dress, it would be simpler to just ask your QM.

 

[Big Bad John]

A link below to a photo of a few of the lads and myself at a Mess Dinner with the Army Air Corps.

http://army.ca/cgi-bin/album.pl?photo=Members/messaac.jpg

 

[John Nayduk]

Thanks, Dave.  We like it.  Don't forget our annual mess dinner on the first Saturday of December, every year.  If you're home visiting, come by.

 

[Armymedic]

So, for this new Sgt,

Where can I grab the white shirt and bow tie for mess dress? (at Canex I presume, but is there as certain style?)

And is there anywhere where they show the "pattern" so that I can get proper mess dress tailored?

 

[Inch]

So, for this new Sgt,

Where can I grab the white shirt and bow tie for mess dress? (at Canex I presume, but is there as certain style?)

And is there anywhere where they show the "pattern" so that I can get proper mess dress tailored?

I bought my shirt and a black bow tie at Moore's. I've seen both styles of shirt, french tips (is that what they're called?) and full collared which I have. Most shirts I've seen have the pleats down the front and the holes for button studs and cuff links.

As for the pattern, talk to the guys that have them and find out where they got them done (you may have to ask, oh I don't want to say it, a junior officer that just had one made   ;D ), most tailors have the patterns already. I had my AF one made in Kingston, ON at Andrei's and he had all 3 elemental patterns and probably even the little differences like for the PPCLI and their grey lapels and cuffs. I can't remember off hand where you're located, but I know there's a guy in Ottawa that a few buddies of mine had make theirs.

 

[Sailing Instructor]

Patterns can be gotten at your base tailor.  Simply take them to any civilian tailor (preferably one who has made these things before, if you don't exactly know what the finished product will look like) & he will laugh at the amount of detail NDHQ puts into what sort of shoulder padding they allow.  (True story, but I've digressed.  Just get the pattern and take it you your tailor.)  

My tailor also made my bowtie as it seems no store sells ready-made bow ties--they do sell those clip on ones, but they aren't really 'ties' if they don't tie, are they?  As for shirts, I had mine made at a shirtmaker, but any shirt store ought to have bib-fronted shirts (either stiff or pleated).   To quote the CF dress instructions:

13. Shirt white (M) (1) Shall be worn with No. 2B order of mess
dress.
a. Plain, long-sleeved, standard
cuff design, with turned down
collar.
(2) Army â “ may have French cuffs.
b. Pleated front, long-sleeved,
French cuffs, with turned down
collar.
(1) May be worn with Nos. 2 and 2A orders
of mess dress. See also items c and d,
that follow.
c. Wing collar and French cuffs.
(1) May be worn with No. 2 and No. 2A
orders of mess dress (for army only,
choice in accordance with
branch/regimental policy).
d. Navy: piqué turned down
collar.
(1) May be worn with No. 2 and No. 2A
orders of mess dress.

14. Shirt (blouse), white
(F)
a. Shirt, plain, long-sleeved
standard cuff design, with
turned down collar.
(1) May be worn with all mess dress,
except No. 2C mess shipboard.
(1) Navy: shall be worn with all mess dress,
except No. 2C mess shipboard.
b. Shirt, long-sleeved, cuffed,
plain or pleated front with wing
collar.
(2) Army and air force: may be worn with all
mess dress, except Nos. 2B and 2C.
c. Army and air force: blouse,
long-sleeved, cuffed, gold-
buttoned front closure, high-
buttoned convertible collar,
polyester fluffy crepe material
(Elite blouse style 2517.)
(1) May be worn with all mess dress,
except No. 2C mess shipboard.

Regarding Big Bad John's posted photo: what are those mess jackets with the stand-up collar & open front called?  Is there a blue vest under them or what?  I've seen a scarlet one of these before but I couldn't figure out it's components.  (I think they look nicer than the modern, dinner-suit-ish mess dress.)

 

[my72jeep]

Believe it or not there is a office in NDHQ that only deals with mess kits Call it tell them what type of mess kit you want your size and 5 days later a set of patterns arrive at your door.

C. Cracknell 613-994-9472

but if your in Borden go to the cannex they will let you have one for 0% intrest two years to pay no payments for 6 months.

 

[John Nayduk]

While not officially mess dress, I was wondering if anybody knows where I can get my hands on a pattern forPatrol Dress?  Different Regiments have slight differences in it but it is all basically the same.  Can anyone help?

 

[Big Bad John]

Royal Marines still wear Blues!  

http://army.ca/cgi-bin/album.pl?photo=Operations/going_home.jpg

 

[DaveK]

While not officially mess dress, I was wondering if anybody knows where I can get my hands on a pattern forPatrol Dress?   Different Regiments have slight differences in it but it is all basically the same.   Can anyone help?

The trousers/overalls would be the same as your normal regimental pattern for full and mess dress.  The tunics are standard less highland regiments.  Unfortunately you would have to find an older dress reg that has your regt/corps in it.  From my research, viewing, etc. they were quite standard less badges, sashes, mail etc.

P.S.  They make midnight blue doeskin.  I think it runs over 300 bux a metre.

 

[hockeysgal]

I've looked at a few of the photos posted on this thread and the mess kit is nice...  But does anyone have photos of women in mess dress, I would like to see what the differences are (if any)

thanks

 

[my72jeep]

I've looked at a few of the photos posted on this thread and the mess kit is nice...   But does anyone have photos of women in mess dress, I would like to see what the differences are (if any)

thanks

replace the pants with a floor lenght skirt

 

[DaveK]

The jackets are different as well if you decide to wear the skirt.

 

[Riobeard]

I know that things differ from branch to branch, but does any one know the definitive answer to who wears the waist coat and who wears a cummerbund with mess kit?  I've seen them both on NCM's and Officers but does anyone know / have access to the actual regulations, appendix and  annex to same?

 

[dangerboy]

I can only speak for the PPCLI, from our Regimental Manual: Waistcoat will be reservered for officer and CWO wear only.  Cummerbund will be worn by all MWO's and bellow and may be worn by officers and CWO's. 

 

[Horse_Soldier]

Mess kit configuration is a regimental/branch thing, since a mess kit is not a uniform, so there is no set rule that applies army-wide,i.e no definitive answer on cummberbund vs waistcoat.

 

[Acorn]

Sorry, mess kit is a uniform, though not issue. There are regulations governing the design, cut and wear of mess kit. In any case, I believe most Regiments/Branches limit waistcoat to CWO/Officer with other NCMs restricted to cummerbund. Which only goes to show that there is still no definitive answer.

Acorn

 

[Fishbone Jones]

The general rule for the Armoured Corps is both waistcoat or cumberbund are allowed for all ranks. Each Regiment however has it's options. These mostly have to do with, but are not limited to, the type and colour of stripe on the overalls and colour variations for the jacket.

The rules and standards for Mess Kit are found in the CF Dress Regs and are broken down by Element, then Corps, then Regiment where applicable.

 

[rifleman]

If a unit is authorized both, cummerbunds are normally summer wear and vests are for winter wear. Some units that are authorized both choose to ignore the dress manual and stick with their own tradition.