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CEOTP (Continuing Ed Officer Trg Plan) 2003-2018 [Merged]

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Heff18 said:
Even though I'll be entering year 2, I have to pay both year 1 + year 2's flight costs, so I better be getting something for that money! (Hopefully the CF picks up the year 1 costs  :o). To this point I've only ever flown a 172 so I'm looking forward to trying out the Diamonds.

  Sorry this is so delayed...dereliction of duty on my part. Seeing as you don't fly in first year, they just spread the 3 years of flight costs across 4 years, so you're not getting hosed. And the CF will pick up your costs. The Diamonds have been real nice for me so far, hope to meet you next year.
 
Forgive me if I have done this incorrectly but after all I am a Granpa!
I am looking for some information to help me in my "cheerleading" role for my granddaughter.  She is interested in becoming a pilot just like her dear old grandpa wanted to be (bad eyes ruled out any aircrew in those days).
On the Forces.ca website I read " Regular Officer Training Plan – Pilots (CAMP) The Commercial Aviation Management Program (CAMP) at the University of Western Ontario is the only university aviation program sponsored by the Canadian Forces Regular Officers Training Plan".
Do they mean the only "civilian" university or is it that she can not attend RMC or CMR and still become a pilot.
I have a million other questions, as does she, but I will leave it at that for the time being seeing as I may be doing everything completley wrong on this forum anyway.

My thanks in advance for any help given
 
That's the only AVIATION university program sponsored by the CF.  RMC and other universities are good, but she won't have and aviation degree at the end.  But you don't need one to be a pilot.
 
grandpa said:
Forgive me if I have done this incorrectly but after all I am a Granpa!
I am looking for some information to help me in my "cheerleading" role for my granddaughter.  She is interested in becoming a pilot just like her dear old grandpa wanted to be (bad eyes ruled out any aircrew in those days).
On the Forces.ca website I read " Regular Officer Training Plan – Pilots (CAMP) The Commercial Aviation Management Program (CAMP) at the University of Western Ontario is the only university aviation program sponsored by the Canadian Forces Regular Officers Training Plan".
Do they mean the only "civilian" university or is it that she can not attend RMC or CMR and still become a pilot.
I have a million other questions, as does she, but I will leave it at that for the time being seeing as I may be doing everything completley wrong on this forum anyway.

My thanks in advance for any help given

The difference between the CAM program and any other ROTP CF program (in a civilian university) is that the flight training is included in the school years.  A CAM graduate will bypass Primary Flight Training as well.
 
In regards to ROTP subsidisation, must you apply to the University of Western CAMP first before applying to the CF reg force for ROTP, or is it the other way around. As well I am in the reserve forces, would this make a differance to my application.
 
benny88  in Reply # 8  posted this information:

Commercial Aviation Management (CAM) Program Sponsorship for Pilots

What is ROTP?
ROTP is the Regular Officer Training Program offered by the Canadian Forces. It is a subsidized education plan for applicants to apply to any ordinary degree program at either RMC (Royal Military College) or at a recognized and pre-authorized civilian university.

What is CAM?
The Commercial Aviation Management (CAM) program at the University of Western Ontario is the only university aviation program sponsored by the Canadian Forces Regular Officers Training Plan (ROTP). CAM is a specialized ROTP module, subsidizing successful candidates for their university education and flight training. CAM is a highly competitive program in which only a few candidates are selected from across Canada.

Why CAM?
The CAM program will equip students with an extensive set of skills and prepare them for a career as a Pilot in the Canadian Forces.

Through the Bachelor of Management and Organizational Studies (BMOS), applicants will gain the capacity for critical thinking, an ability to adapt to change, and strong problem-solving and communication skills. At the same time, they will have the opportunity to study advanced aviation topics, accounting, finance, marketing, and operations management as well as liberal arts courses in the Faculty of Social Science. The result is a unique education experience that is ideal preparation for employment as a Pilot and Officer in the Canadian Forces.

Students will graduate with a four-year Bachelor of Management and Organizational Studies Degree.

Graduates of the Commercial Aviation Management Program will be sponsored by the Chief of the Air Staff (CAS) to take the flight training operation and will be licensed to fly commercial aircraft. Those completing the flight option in years 2, 3 and 4 of the BMOS program receive more than 400 hours of integrated ground school instruction and 260 hours of flight and simulator time, and earn the following:

- Private Pilot Licence
- Commercial Pilot Licence
- Multi-Engine Rating
- Group 1 Instrument Rating

Flight training in years 2, 3, and 4 operates from September until June, and is conducted in accordance with the new Transport Canada Integrated Commercial Pilot Licence program.

Who qualifies?
The applicant must meet all requirements for ROTP pilots and be enrolled in the Bachelor of Management and Organizational Studies with the specialization of Commercial Aviation Management at the University of Western Ontario. No alternative aviation programs are permitted. (ie. RMC, Seneca, Waterloo etc…)


Key differences between the ROTP and the CAM application process

ROTP Process
When an applicant applies for the pilot occupation with ROTP they are processed for Air Operations rather than the specific trade of Pilot.
Step 1:
Applicant must complete an initial interview, medical and aptitude test at their respective recruiting centre
Step 2:
Applicant must pass the aircrew selection held in Trenton, Ontario
Step 3:
Applicant must achieve a military medical Air Factor of 1 at the Defence Research and Development Centre (DRDC) in Toronto
Step 4:
Applicant must successfully compete their first year at their respective university

NOTE: Depending on the applicant’s performance in their first year, they may or may not qualify for the pilot occupation. Their prior admission into Air Operations may include occupations as Pilot, Navigator or Aerospace Control
 
CAM ROTP Process
When an applicant applies for the pilot occupation with CAM they are processed specifically as a Pilot rather than Air Operations.

Identical Steps 1 through 3 applies to CAM, Step 4 is what sets the CAM and the ROTP selection process apart.

Step 4:
If successful the applicant will be 1 out of a few applicants across Canada to be admitted into CAM where they are enrolled as pilots and not in Air Operations.

NOTE: if successful, they are now guaranteed their first choice of occupation (Pilot).

Benefits
Candidates of ROTP CAM will receive their education in the BMOS CAM program at the University of Western Ontario completely subsidized. This amounts to approximately $5000 a year, totalling approximately $20,000 over the four year degree. Candidates will receive flight training subsidized by the Chief of the Air Staff (CAS), which amounts to approximately $15,000 a year, totalling approximately $60,000 over the four years. Mandatory books and supplies are also subsidized for the candidates. Candidates will also receive an annual salary of approximately $17,000 a year totally approximately $70,000 over the four years as an officer cadet. The time spent at the university as an Officer Cadet is pensionable and additional benefits include complete Canadian Forces health/dental care and 4 weeks leave.





Career Path
During the candidate’s first summer as an Officer Cadet, they will complete Basic Military Officer Qualifications (BMOQ). This must be completed prior to the onset of their second year of study. The following summers, the Officer Cadet will receive employment or on-the-job-training.

At the successful completion of the BMOS Commercial Aviation Management degree, the Officer Cadet will be sent directly to Basic Flight Training in Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan, bypassing the Primary Flight training stage in Portage la Prairie, Manitoba that all other ROTP pilots must attend. After receiving their wings, pilots will be assigned to a squadron to continue their career as a pilot in the Canadian Forces.

NOTE: Candidates must complete a minimum obligatory period of eight years following their graduation before they are allowed release from the Canadian Forces.

Points to note:
Once at the University of Western Ontario they must remember they are no longer students but rather Officer Cadets for the Canadian Forces hence they must conduct themselves in an orderly manner that respects the Canadian Forces. They are not permitted to accept other employment as their tuition is subsidized and they earn a salary.

Quick Facts
• CAM is specialized ROTP module
• Only 6 applications for CAM were accepted nationwide for processing in 2008.
• Total Value of scholarship = $150,000
o $80,000/4years for tuition, flying, books/supplies
o $70,000/4 years of earned salary
• CAM applicants are guaranteed Pilot occupation
• By-pass primary flight training
• Great way to pay for university and flight training and build aviation experience
• Time spent at the University of Western Ontario as an Officer Cadet is pensionable time
• CF health/dental care
 
New course website at flyuwo.com

The site is still in the works, and there's nothing too new on there, it's just up-to-date and more concise. As always, post or PM me if you want to know more about the program.


 
Does anybody know the availability of ROTP through the Science and Aviation program at University of Waterloo? It is a University Degree program, but I haven't found any information on it in the forum.
 
i'm in science and aviation at UW, 2nd year.  ROTP isn't offered the same way as it is for the CAM program.  as far as i know, we don't have anyone in ROTP, although I know a few people who are applying, although due to a backlog in pilot training i've heard very few people are being accepted. PM me if you have any questions
 
If you were to be accepted for ROTP, they would subsidize your tuition and related fees, but not the flight training. UWO's CAM is the only fully subsidized flight degree.
 
New to this site, but am going through ROTP process right now and plan on going to UWO CAM 1st year in Sept 2010. Was told by recruiter that ROTP only covers the undergraduate degree and that the Air Force will no longer cover any related flight costs.
Anybody else hear this.. Also was told need high 80's percent U level courses to get into CAM>
 
I've heard conflicting reports, but having just talked to recruiter, it appears flight costs are no longer covered.
 
Also heard that intake of pilots will be low or none this year because of backlog of training of existing pilots. Does anyone think that there will a lot less or no ROTP candidates from UWO CAMP? I plan on defintely going to UWO and am working on the marks to get there so maybe I will have to stay in the civie world.
 
Good Day Everyone,

I've been a Lurker on this forum for a number of months now, and have spent many hours searching through old threads.  I have found lots of very usefull information here that has helped me a great deal, and answered many questions I may have had. 

I am aware that the PILOT trade is Closed for 2009 and I am fully aware of the large training backlog in the system.  I understand that CEOTP most likely WON'T be open for the next several years if at all. As well, I do understand that it only opens sporadically when there are shortfalls with the other entry plans.

I joined the Pres last year, and am very much enjoying the military lifestyle, and would like to CT to the Reg force as a pilot within the next several years (after I become fully qualified and give some time back to my unit).

I've completed 1 year of university.  I have a Private Fixed Wing Pilot's Licence, and am just about to flight test for my Commercial Helicopter Licence.  Upon completion, I will hopefully be Pilot/operating in the oilfield for a few years to build some time, while continuing my Pres training.

So, enough history. 

My questions is this.  The CEOTP (when or if it opens in the future), from what I can surmise, is only open to skilled pilots.  Now, what constitutes a skilled pilot?  I understand a skilled pilot applicant will bypass PFT in portage.  Is that for Commercially rated Fixed wing only?  Or would a Private Fixed wing Pilot (with a commercial Helicopter ticket) be able to bypass this phase as well??  I guess ultimatley I would love to become a pilot in the Reg force.  Hopefully one day the CEOTP will open up again, and I would like to be ready for that.  In the meantime, I will continue with my civvy pilot career/Pres training and play the waiting game.


Also, I haven't seen too many application samples that are similar to my situation.  If anyone out there was in a similar situation as me, I would be interested to hear your experiences and/or thoughts on my competitiveness as an applicant. 

Anyway, thanks very much in advance for all of your time. 

Rob   

Mods -  Wasn't sure if this should be in recruiting or somewhere else.  Feel free to move it if you like.
 
Hey everyone, sorry to have been AWOL from my own thread.

    AFAIK, flight training is still covered. I know mine for sure will be until the end of my program. I spoke to my SEM (Subsidized Education Manager, a Captain who is in charge of all ROTP members and activities in a geographic area)  because I heard those same rumblings and had a friend who was interested in the program. My SEM said that there were no plans to stop offering subsidization for the flight training at this time, but that it was being reviewed because of delays of members getting to postings because of flight training.
    I should catch wind of it fairly early on if something changes, in which case I'll post it, but I recommend continuing with the application. You could also try contacting the CFRC here in London, because I know they're the most knowledgable about the program.

  Good luck
 
I have talked and confirmed with both the SEM and CFRC London that all new CAM applicants will no longer be funded for their flight training. Tuition and books will all be covered as per usual ROTP, but if the flight option is chosen, the costs will have to be covered by the applicant.

The CAM program is currently under going some modification to help diversify the specialization from it's heavy finance focus by offering courses in the human resource management option and opening up the overall course offerings to mix and match with a variety of management & organizational courses in later years.

Nearing the end of my first year, I look forward to what the next few years will bring and can't wait to get back up in the skies next year.

Good luck to all CAM applicants, and hopefully see you next year!
 
CAM was a one-off project by AF-FG to help offset some training backlogs.  While ROTP covered the costs associated with tuition, books, etc.  The Air Force budget covered the cost of the actual flight training.  With current fiscal constraints and the system slowing pulling itself out of the quagmire, the benefits of this course to the AF is not tangible.  In the end - it saved the pilot candidate one course.  Now it's back to PFT in Portage for everyone.
 
Zoomie said:
the benefits of this course to the AF is not tangible.  In the end - it saved the pilot candidate one course.

I would like to see statistics for how many CAM grads are successful in BFT and AFT/OTUs versus those with just PFT, but I think you'd be proven right in that the difference would be negligible. I'm glad I entered the program, but that's mostly just because I love to fly, not because I think it will give me an edge as a military pilot.
 
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