CDN/US Covid-related political discussion

OceanBonfire

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So, according to Amnesty International, we're the country that bought the most shots/doses based on population size:

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/rich-countries-including-canada-have-bought-too-many-covid-19-vaccines-amnesty-1.5223130

https://globalnews.ca/news/7510507/amnesty-international-rich-nations-canada-coronavirus-vaccine/
 

OldSolduer

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Remius said:
There are some out there that think the that the doom and gloom of mental health resulting from COVID may in fact be inflated somewhat.


https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/stress-relief/202011/criticism-covid-psychological-tsunami-it-may-be-inflated

I have not read the article but I think some people will be negatively affected for a long time - the vast majority will not be over the long term.
 

FJAG

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Hamish Seggie said:
I have not read the article but I think some people will be negatively affected for a long time - the vast majority will not be over the long term.

Go ahead and read the article. In short it talks about the fact that there is a host of junk science out there inflating the issue.

There's little doubt that some people will be negatively affected by the semi isolation which we are enduring and for some there will clearly be negative financial effects. Personally I miss the contact with my kids and grandkids who are staying away because they don't want to kill grandad and grandma. I miss the trip to Europe that ended up being cancelled in April. I'd also rather be doing other things than hang around the house this winter.

On the other hand I'm certainly not clinically depressed and I know that others are dealing equally well with the issue based on the people I talk to through "safer" means. We still talk to the kids and our friends by phone weekly and everyone is bearing up well. We need to differentiate between what constitutes a mental health crisis and what is a momentary feeling of unhappiness that will pass when things return to a more normal existence.

I don't want to sell short the limited (but large) number of people who will suffer because of this, but I think that we need to keep a perspective about the effect this is having on society as a whole. Unlike you, I think that the "vast majority" will get over this in the short term. The worst thing that we can do is start fostering a victim mentality. People are too easily influenced by the ratcheted up social media tripe and the lazy mainstream media reporting that floats around us. Tell a person often enough that they have a problem and pretty soon they have it.

:cheers:
 

mariomike

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Remius said:
There are some out there that think the that the doom and gloom of mental health resulting from COVID may in fact be inflated somewhat.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/stress-relief/202011/criticism-covid-psychological-tsunami-it-may-be-inflated

Good grief. The Covid winter of 2020 is the battle of my lifetime. The couch is my front-line! My weapon is the remote!  :) Joking.

Maybe humans used to be more resilient ? People made it through the 1918 pandemic,  two world wars, and the Great Depression of the 1930s.
 

daftandbarmy

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On COVID and brain damage....

"The bottom line
There is one inevitable conclusion from these studies: COVID infection frequently leads to brain damage — particularly in those over 70. While sometimes the brain damage is obvious and leads to major cognitive impairment, more frequently the damage is mild, leading to difficulties with sustained attention."

The hidden long-term cognitive effects of COVID-19
POSTED OCTOBER 08, 2020, 2:30 PM
Andrew E. Budson, MDAndrew E. Budson, MD
Contributor

The COVID pandemic has now claimed as many American lives as World War I, the Vietnam War, and the Korean War combined. Most of these deaths are due to the well-known pulmonary complications of the coronavirus. It has become increasingly recognized, however, that the virus also attacks the nervous system. Doctors in a large Chicago medical center found that more than 40% of patients with COVID showed neurologic manifestations at the outset, and more than 30% of those had impaired cognition. Sometimes the neurological manifestations can be devastating and can even lead to death.

However, new research is now suggesting that there may be long-term neurologic consequences in those who survive COVID infections, including more than seven million Americans and another 27 million people worldwide. Particularly troubling is increasing evidence that there may be mild — but very real — brain damage that occurs in many survivors, causing pervasive yet subtle cognitive, behavioral, and psychological problems.

How COVID damages the brain
COVID can cause damage to the brain directly by encephalitis, which may have devastating or subtle consequences. In one British study of 12 patients with encephalitis, one made a full recovery, 10 made a partial recovery, and one died. This study also found that a number of patients with COVID suffered strokes. In fact, COVID infection is a risk factor for strokes. A group of Canadian doctors found that individuals over 70 years of age were at particularly high risk for stroke related to COVID infection, but even young individuals are seven times more likely to have a stroke from this coronavirus versus a typical flu virus.

Autopsy data from COVID patients in Finland suggests that another major cause of brain damage is lack of oxygen. Particularly worrisome is that several of the patients who were autopsied did not show any signs of brain injury during the course of their COVID infection — yet all had brain damage. In one patient there was loss of taste, and in two there was “minimal respiratory distress,” but none of these patients were thought to have any brain damage while alive.

Major cognitive effects of COVID
In survivors of intensive care unit (ICU) stays due to acute respiratory failure or shock from any cause, one-third of people show such a profound degree of cognitive impairment that performance on neuropsychological testing is comparable to those with moderate traumatic brain injury. In daily life, such cognitive effects on memory, attention, and executive function can lead to difficulties managing medications, managing finances, comprehending written materials, and even carrying on conversations with friends and family. Commonly observed long-term psychological effects of ICU stays include anxiety, depression, and post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). Effects due to COVID ICU stays are expected to be similar — a prediction that has already been confirmed by the studies in Britain, Canada, and Finland reviewed above.

Subtle cognitive effects of COVID
It is clear that COVID can cause brain damage by direct infection (encephalitis), by strokes, and by lack of oxygen. It is also clear that when patients experience severe illness requiring an ICU stay, brain damage is highly likely to occur, and its effects are typically obvious. But what if the COVID illness is not so severe? Can brain damage still occur?

A Chinese group of doctors and researchers examined several aspects of cognitive function in 29 individuals who were thought to have fully recovered from COVID infection. They found persistent impairment in sustained attention — the ability to attend to important information for as long as it is relevant.

Long-term cognitive effects of COVID infection
Why would sustained attention be persistently impaired in individuals who were thought to have fully recovered from COVID? The Chinese group thought it might be linked to underlying inflammatory processes. But it is equally likely that patients with COVID suffered silent strokes or lack of oxygen that damaged their brains. As discussed above, strokes due to COVID are common, particularly in those over 70. We know that silent strokes frequently occur, and are a risk factor for both large strokes and dementia. Silent strokes typically affect the brain’s white matter — the wiring between brain cells that enables different parts of the brain to communicate with each other. This wiring is essential for attention, and when it is damaged, sustained attention is impaired.

The bottom line
There is one inevitable conclusion from these studies: COVID infection frequently leads to brain damage — particularly in those over 70. While sometimes the brain damage is obvious and leads to major cognitive impairment, more frequently the damage is mild, leading to difficulties with sustained attention.

Although many people who have recovered from COVID can resume their daily lives without difficulty — even if they have some deficits in attention — there are a number of people who may experience difficulty now or later. One recently published paper from a group of German and American doctors concluded that the combination of direct effects of the virus, systemic inflammation, strokes, and damage to bodily organs (like lungs and liver) could even make COVID survivors at high risk for Alzheimer’s disease in the future. Individuals whose professions involve medical care, legal advice, financial planning, or leadership — including political leaders — may need to be carefully evaluated with formal neuropsychological testing, including measures of sustained attention, to assure that their cognition has not been compromised.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/the-hidden-long-term-cognitive-effects-of-covid-2020100821133
 

Weinie

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mariomike said:
Good grief. The Covid winter of 2020 is the battle of my lifetime. The couch is my front-line! My weapon is the remote!  :) Joking.

Maybe humans used to be more resilient ? People made it through the 1918 pandemic,  two world wars, and the Great Depression of the 1930s.

That's why many were referred to as "The Greatest Generation."
 

daftandbarmy

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Weinie said:
That's why many were referred to as "The Greatest Generation."

At the risk of introducing a tangent, there are a few 'issues' with that generation too:

The Greatest Generation and the Greatest Illusion
Success in World War II led Americans to put too much faith in government—and we still do.

Americans learned several misleading lessons from World War II. The first and greatest error was overestimating the effectiveness of military force. World War II—the last conflict in which the world’s great powers went toe-to-toe against each other, with no holds barred—created a new understanding of how wars are fought and won. But wars since then have not fit this paradigm, and many of our subsequent military mistakes came as a result of misapplying World War II’s lessons.

Lyndon Johnson led the country into a massive military commitment in South Vietnam in part because of misplaced faith in what the United States could accomplish by force of arms. The Johnson administration convinced itself that fighting modern wars was a branch of management science, akin to running a large corporation like General Motors, and that America’s military was a versatile instrument that could be dialed up or down to deliver precisely calibrated levels of violence, tailored to meet any foreign policy challenge. World War II also led many Americans to conclude that liberal democracy could be imposed on foreign peoples through the application of what George W. Bush’s administration would later call “shock and awe.”

https://www.city-journal.org/html/greatest-generation-and-greatest-illusion-15622.html
 

Spencer100

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mariomike said:
Good grief. The Covid winter of 2020 is the battle of my lifetime. The couch is my front-line! My weapon is the remote!  :) Joking.

Maybe humans used to be more resilient ? People made it through the 1918 pandemic,  two world wars, and the Great Depression of the 1930s.

Please know that for some it is the battle of a lifetime.  Life's work going up in flames! Millions and millions  lost.  I myself are borrowing money to stay afloat.  Trying to keep employees.  Hardest year of my life. Many many people depend on the moves my team makes.  It breaks my heart see small businesses being destroyed.

I would ask you look at others that that can't just sit on the couch and watch netflix.  (sorry this just burns my ass.)
 

mariomike

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Spencer100 said:
I would ask you look at others that that can't just sit on the couch and watch netflix.  (sorry this just burns my ass.)

I keep in touch with friends still on the job. They keep me informed. I also remember my time in quarantine during SARS.

 

suffolkowner

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Spencer100 said:
Please know that for some it is the battle of a lifetime.  Life's work going up in flames! Millions and millions  lost.  I myself are borrowing money to stay afloat.  Trying to keep employees.  Hardest year of my life. Many many people depend on the moves my team makes.  It breaks my heart see small businesses being destroyed.

I would ask you look at others that that can't just sit on the couch and watch netflix.  (sorry this just burns my ***.)

Yep the cost for a lot of small business owners will be high. One does tend to have a different on things when you don't get paid
 

QV

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mariomike said:
Good grief. The Covid winter of 2020 is the battle of my lifetime. The couch is my front-line! My weapon is the remote!  :) Joking.

Maybe humans used to be more resilient ? People made it through the 1918 pandemic,  two world wars, and the Great Depression of the 1930s.

For the record those 300 mp you got from me were supposed to be -300 for your insensitivity to all those people who have lost their livelihoods during these lockdowns.  Glad your couch is your front line, hero.
 

mariomike

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QV said:
Glad your couch is your front line, hero.

Don't worry about my couch, hero. Our emergency services are the front line.

Guess you missed this part,

mariomike said:


This Covid PSA may require a sense of humour to appreciate the point I was trying to make,

'Be lazy, save lives,' Germans urged in COVID video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FS1DDn2eklU

A tongue-in-cheek video clip that urges young Germans to do their patriotic duty in the war against coronavirus by just staying at home and being couch potatoes has become an internet sensation.

QV said:
For the record those 300 mp you got from me were supposed to be -300

For the record, that breaks my heart.  :)




 

Weinie

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daftandbarmy said:
At the risk of introducing a tangent, there are a few 'issues' with that generation too:

The Greatest Generation and the Greatest Illusion
Success in World War II led Americans to put too much faith in government—and we still do.

Americans learned several misleading lessons from World War II. The first and greatest error was overestimating the effectiveness of military force. World War II—the last conflict in which the world’s great powers went toe-to-toe against each other, with no holds barred—created a new understanding of how wars are fought and won. But wars since then have not fit this paradigm, and many of our subsequent military mistakes came as a result of misapplying World War II’s lessons.

Lyndon Johnson led the country into a massive military commitment in South Vietnam in part because of misplaced faith in what the United States could accomplish by force of arms. The Johnson administration convinced itself that fighting modern wars was a branch of management science, akin to running a large corporation like General Motors, and that America’s military was a versatile instrument that could be dialed up or down to deliver precisely calibrated levels of violence, tailored to meet any foreign policy challenge. World War II also led many Americans to conclude that liberal democracy could be imposed on foreign peoples through the application of what George W. Bush’s administration would later call “shock and awe.”

https://www.city-journal.org/html/greatest-generation-and-greatest-illusion-15622.html


Always easy to look at things from 75-90 years ago through todays lens and current sensitivities, and criticize them.

 

daftandbarmy

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Weinie said:
Always easy to look at things from 75-90 years ago through todays lens and current sensitivities, and criticize them.

Dude.... give me some slack, it's what I do for a living :)
 

Jarnhamar

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Important priorities.



A total of 1,790 people entering Canada during the COVID-19 pandemic have received special ministerial permission to skip quarantine — because their trip was deemed in the national interest.

The bulk of the exemptions — 84 per cent — were granted to professional sports league players and staff, and 15 per cent were given to business travellers.
https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/ottawa-granted-1-700-special-quarantine-exemptions-to-sports-leagues-and-business-travellers/ar-BB1bT1td?li=AAggXBV
 

Oldgateboatdriver

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Let's see here: 84% of  approximately 1800 is 1512.

The Stanley cup playoffs had 18 American teams. With 25 players (you include the spares), coaching staff, Directing staff, medical staff and technical support staff, that's a little over 50 people each team: That gives you  more than 900 of the 1512. Now, the Whitecaps, Toronto FC and Impact all had to go to Orlando for MLS Restart tournament and then come back to Canada.That's probably another 140 right there. And that's every-time they do it (The Impact, for instance came back to Canada twice as part of their season and will have to come back again next week after their CONCACAF Champion league game.

Does't take that long or many instances for these sports number to go up, does it.

What is really amazing would be how few exceptions were granted outside of pro-sports. That is a government holding the line if ever I saw one.
 

PuckChaser

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Considering the NHL players were tested everyday in their bubble, no issues with them skipping quarantine. I'd want to know more about the business travelers.
 

Oldgateboatdriver

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PuckChaser said:
Considering the NHL players were tested everyday in their bubble, no issues with them skipping quarantine. I'd want to know more about the business travelers.

Perhaps. But you are looking at less than 200 people, versus that being the number of people coming to Canada from the US every 20 minutes in normal times, and then spread over nine months. That doesn't even qualify as a trickle.
 

Jarnhamar

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Politicians leading by example



Ontario finance minister on holiday trip outside Canada as health officials urge people to stay home
Ontario Finance Minister Rod Phillips travelled outside of the country for a personal vacation recently, his office said Tuesday.


Toronto's NEWSTALK1010 radio station reported the trip was taken after the legislative session ended earlier this month and said it appears to contravene recent pleas by Premier Doug Ford for people to stay home over the holidays.

 

PuckChaser

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Who cares? As long as he does the 14 day quarantine, go for it. Maybe he's leading by example that all these lockdown rules don't make sense with the actual statistics of the last 10 months of 2 weeks to flatten the curve.
 
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