Canada doesn’t matter to the rest of the world - and it’s our own fault

[KevinB]

Cant be on a HMC Ship without secret.

A Secret really shouldn’t take much longer than a month to process. Simply cases can be done in a week.

 

[OldSolduer]

A Secret really shouldn’t take much longer than a month to process. Simply cases can be done in a week.

Back in the day when Canada and the US were chock full of Soviet spies and sympathizers it might have taken a month. Once the MPs had your paperwork and it was all in order it was pretty much done in a timely fashion.
One of the guys I served with was a RadOp and he lost his clearance temporarily when it was discovered his friend was a dirt pinko Commie.

 

[ueo]

Taking over a year to hire any person is unacceptable. Just another example of a broken system that needs complete overhaul.

The CAF should be able to bring people on inside 4 months.

Way back when (90's) we were capable of attracting, processing and actually enroling candidates in less than 30 days, barring med delays. That was befor the 'Muricans sold an unnamed admiral the whole concept of TQM which has morphed into the abomination we have today.

 

[Quirky]

Don't most people wait on PAT platoon before getting trades training?

They just post them to the units and treat QL3s as any other course, that's what they do with air techs now anyway. Instead of mulling about for 6 months at Borden in PAT Platoon, we can at least give them basic elementary and servicing tasks while they wait.

 

[CountDC]

Almost everyone joining the CAF can get by without a clearance for the first year+. Very little risk is assumed in hiring without a completed clearance for 90% of jobs, but a mechanism should be in place to turf someone who can't eventually obtain a clearance.

There is - it's called an irregular enrolment that enables us to release members if something is found out of sorts such as a criminal record or medical condition not revealed. Basically anything that would keep the person from getting a security clearance and was not revealed could qualify as an irregular enrolment.

We send people on deployments with clearance in process so we should be able to enrol and course load with in process. Starting the clearance should be part of the enrolment paperwork process. Security clearances are another system that needs to be fixed. I really got fed up with submitting them and then getting a notice after 2 years that they had to be redone because they were now stale dated.

I went through enrolment, medical, finger printing, security check done within a month. What are we really doing now that is taking so long? I talked to some subordinates at work and they took over a year, the trade was fully open and several courses run each year. We are even offering enrolment bonuses now because we are so short.

This is most certainly a system that needs to be fixed as most applicants should be either rejected or cleared for enrolment a lot quicker than they currrently are.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

They just post them to the units and treat QL3s as any other course, that's what they do with air techs now anyway. Instead of mulling about for 6 months at Borden in PAT Platoon, we can at least give them basic elementary and servicing tasks while they wait.

Maybe in your fleet, but not Cyclone. Nobody can touch that aircraft without Level 2. Including “basic elementary and servicing tasks”.

 

[dimsum]

Maybe in your fleet, but not Cyclone. Nobody can touch that aircraft without Level 2. Including “basic elementary and servicing tasks”.

There will be fleets where pers likely won’t even get in the building, let alone touch the aircraft, without Level 2 or higher.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Way back when (90's) we were capable of attracting, processing and actually enroling candidates in less than 30 days, barring med delays. That was befor the 'Muricans sold an unnamed admiral the whole concept of TQM which has morphed into the abomination we have today.

What is TQM ?

 

[Quirky]

Maybe in your fleet, but not Cyclone. Nobody can touch that aircraft without Level 2. Including “basic elementary and servicing tasks”.

How unfortunate.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

How unfortunate.

Hate the game, not the player…

 

[daftandbarmy]

What is TQM ?

A life preserver for North American business


In the late 1970s and early 1980s, the developed countries of North America and Western Europe suffered economically in the face of stiff competition from Japan's ability to produce high-quality goods at competitive cost. For the first time since the start of the Industrial Revolution, the United Kingdom became a net importer of finished goods. The United States undertook its own soul-searching, expressed most pointedly in the television broadcast of If Japan Can... Why Can't We?. Firms began reexamining the techniques of quality control invented over the past 50 years and how those techniques had been so successfully employed by the Japanese. It was in the midst of this economic turmoil that TQM took root.

Total quality management - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[dapaterson]

What is TQM ?

Total Quality Management, an MBA buzzword.

 

[dimsum]

How unfortunate.

As military aircraft become more advanced, that’s going to be the case. Advanced systems will require higher security clearances to work on them, as well as their support infrastructure.

 

[Good2Golf]

Total Quality Management, an MBA buzzword.

Ha! I match you TQM and Kaizen you 5Ss!

 

[SeaKingTacco]

There will be fleets where pers likely won’t even get in the building, let alone touch the aircraft, without Level 2 or higher.

Much higher.

This is about to suck, unless CSIS can get much, much faster on clearances. DND has actually improved it process quite a bit and files move reasonably well to a very narrow venturi that we do not control…

 

[dimsum]

Much higher.

…well, I wanted to be intentionally vague…

 

[QV]

This thread is a great example of why things are f**ked. "Can't"... should not be in the CAF's vocabulary. "Can't this, can't that" F**k all that... no wonder we are paralyzed.

There is no acceptable reason why the CAF takes well over 4 months and sometimes years to enroll people. If the CAF "can't" then things need to change drastically, whether that is the screening process, or how personnel are managed until the screening is achieved... the answer simply must not be "can't". Find solutions.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

This thread is a great example of why things are f**ked. "Can't"... should not be in the CAF's vocabulary. "Can't this, can't that" F**k all that... no wonder we are paralyzed.

There is no acceptable reason why the CAF takes well over 4 months and sometimes years to enroll people. If the CAF "can't" then things need to change drastically, whether that is the screening process, or how personnel are managed until the screening is achieved... the answer simply must not be "can't". Find solutions.

Have you read anything, anything at all, in the last 10 pages?

I am all for assessing blame/shame. But I am telling you that not all the levers are in DND’s control.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Ha! I match you TQM and Kaizen you 5Ss!

Careful, or I just might haul out my Lean Six Sigma Black Belt!

 

[FJAG]

Have you read anything, anything at all, in the last 10 pages?

I am all for assessing blame/shame. But I am telling you that not all the levers are in DND’s control.

But even that shouldn't stop it. There are points in time when interdepartmental action has to be mandated by the GiC.

Unless the wheel becomes so squeaky that GiC is prompted to take action, things will just coast along unresolved. IMHO issues are never elevated to that level because they are considered too unimportant to take up valuable cabinet time.

There is always the press and parliamentary question period. You need to be loud and prepared to point fingers. Folks at many levels are just too reluctant to push and keep pushing upward problems which have become systemic, permanent but are fixable at higher levels. Career preservation concerns enter the chat.