Battle Fitness: Does the BFT really prepare us for battle?

[Sig_Des]

I'm a big proponent of everyone in a green environment having the ability to be able to just ruck up and do a BFT. Like it has been pointed out, it's the BASIC test.

Also, it requires some preparedness. Members need to know how to dress properly. I was amazed when I did my last BFT in November to see one guy wearing every piece of thermal gear he owned, plus jacket. Needless to say, after about 30 minutes, he was dizzy, and 15 minutes later, he'd overheated. People need to be smart about how they go about it.

 

[Celticgirl]

Question: When doing the BFT on basic, if you do not complete the ruck march or the fireman's carry (or both), do you fail? If so, what are the repercussions of that? I am curious after watching two people fall out of the march on Basic Up around the halfway point. Would they have had to do it again?

 

[aesop081]

Question: When doing the BFT on basic, if you do not complete the ruck march or the fireman's carry (or both), do you fail? If so, what are the repercussions of that? I am curious after watching two people fall out of the march on Basic Up around the halfway point. Would they have had to do it again?

Just pass and you wont have to worry about it.

 

[Celticgirl]

Just pass and you wont have to worry about it.

Oh, I *will* pass.  ;D  I am just curious. The reason being that it seems unfair that some march the whole 13 K while others do 6 or 7 K and get driven back, potentially without consequences.

 

[Pea]

Oh, I *will* pass.  ;D  I am just curious. The reason being that it seems unfair that some march the whole 13 K while others do 6 or 7 K and get driven back, potentially without consequences.

You have PO checks (Performance objective)  in Basic training, if you do not complete the 13km it is considered a PO failure. You are allowed so many "failed PO's" before you are recoursed. So if the individual hasn't failed any PO's previously, or is below the allowed number (I forget what the amount is, I think it's 3, but don't quote me on that) then they will still pass Basic Training.

 

[Celticgirl]

You have PO checks (Performance objective)  in Basic training, if you do not complete the 13km it is considered a PO failure. You are allowed so many "failed PO's" before you are recoursed. So if the individual hasn't failed any PO's previously, or is below the allowed number (I forget what the amount is, I think it's 3, but don't quote me on that) then they will still pass Basic Training.

Thanks, Pea! That is exactly what I was wondering. Good to know.

 

[Blackthorne]

  But I am unclear as to what it proves - digging a shell scrape in gravel in 6 minutes.  As for the ammo box lift - 48 boxes in 5 minutes.
These tasks are an annoyance, harmful if done incorrectly and IMHO do not really meet the intention as stated in AFS Manual, "designed to ensure that you are capable of enduring the rigours of operations and, if necessary, combat."  Are we tossing ammo boxes rather than grenades at the enemy? 

Sorry, but as an infanteer, I have to disagree with you on this one.

Annoyances? Making sure a gunner is well fed in a firefight is an annoyance? Digging cover to get out of harms way fast when engaged is an annoyance?

Plus, I think you missed the word operations entirely. This can be day in day out stuff. The ammo doesn't walk itself around and defensive positions don't get dig on their own. I don't mean to come off harsh but seriously man.

This is CORE stuff. Being familiar with it and being able to do it fast could mean the difference between holding and being over run.

 

[Fusaki]

Sorry, but as an infanteer, I have to disagree with you on this one.

Annoyances? Making sure a gunner is well fed in a firefight is an annoyance? Digging cover to get out of harms way fast when engaged is an annoyance?

Plus, I think you missed the word operations entirely. This can be day in day out stuff. The ammo doesn't walk itself around and defensive positions don't get dig on their own. I don't mean to come off harsh but seriously man.

This is CORE stuff. Being familiar with it and being able to do it fast could mean the difference between holding and being over run.

As an infanteer, I still think the new additions to the BFT are pretty ghey.

While it's true that sometimes you need to carry around ammo... well... who cares? It's like testing to see if a soldier can tie his shoelaces. Use of a shovel should not be a PO check. It's just a shovel. JUST DIG! Sure, it's better if you can dig a hole faster, but really. Who digs holes for PT? No one that I ever heard of. It's just something that you do when you're told. The 13KM march and firemans carry is an important in establishing a base level of fitness. All the other stuff is just sucking eggs.

I've done the defensive thing, working for weeks on bunkers, comms trenches, sandbagging. Never once did I feel cheated for not having done enough shovel PT.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

As an infanteer, I still think the new additions to the BFT are pretty ghey.

While it's true that sometimes you need to carry around ammo... well... who cares? It's like testing to see if a soldier can tie his shoelaces. Use of a shovel should not be a PO check. It's just a shovel. JUST DIG! Sure, it's better if you can dig a hole faster, but really. Who digs holes for PT? No one that I ever heard of. It's just something that you do when you're told. The 13KM march and firemans carry is an important in establishing a base level of fitness. All the other stuff is just sucking eggs.

I've done the defensive thing, working for weeks on bunkers, comms trenches, sandbagging. Never once did I feel cheated for not having done enough shovel PT.

Sounds similar to the logic that my MCpl had in Basic: "kicking yourself in the nuts isn't going to make you any better at receiving a kick in the nuts."

 

[Fusaki]

Sounds similar to the logic that my MCpl had in Basic: "kicking yourself in the nuts isn't going to make you any better at receiving a kick in the nuts."

I don't entirely agree with that one either. Alot can be said for a gut check just for the sake of it.

What I'm trying to get at is this:

The 13km march needs to be tested because if it's not some people are going to fail it. Yes, there are those who can do one ruck march a year and make the BFT in under 2:26, but I'd say there are quite a few people who need to train for it or else they won't make it in on time. And if they do make it in on time, they'll be broken. People need to do ruck marches for PT, and their fitness needs to meet a certain standard.

The "shell scrape dig" and "ammo box lift" is different. We don't train in this sort of stuff for PT because it's not really necessary to be super fast at it. Digging a defensive is something that takes hours or days to do, and you could be improving on your position for weeks. It's hard work, but 6 minutes of shifting gravel is not an accurate measure of how well you're going to do at it. It's like testing your 100meter dash to see how you'll do on a marathon.