Author Topic: Political Correctness  (Read 16129 times)

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Offline Lumber

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Political Correctness
« on: August 30, 2016, 14:29:10 »
New - Headdress controversy points to bigger problems, First Nations educator says

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/montreal-school-headdress-lajoie-1.3741254

Quote
"I'm slightly concerned that people who don't understand how this is offensive are then going to teach children about Indigenous people."

I'm one of these "people". I just don't understand how this is offensive. If my kids were learning about Germany in school, and the teacher decided to wear Lederhosen, would that be offensive? If they were learning about Japanese culture, would a Kimono be offensive? What about a sari? Or Highland dress?

I'm not trying to be rude, I'm legitimately ignorant; I just don't see how this was offensive.

Care to shed some light, Lightguns?
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Offline Lightguns

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2016, 14:32:39 »
Concur, the progressive bandwagon is sounding Taps again.  But this story, the alarmed individuals who started it are an example of why our society is degrading.  The PC folks got their names in the news and are going to get their pound of flesh as well. 
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Offline Dimsum

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #2 on: August 30, 2016, 14:41:52 »
Concur, the progressive bandwagon is sounding Taps again.  But this story, the alarmed individuals who started it are an example of why our society is degrading.  The PC folks got their names in the news and are going to get their pound of flesh as well.

Judging purely on the article and its pictures, maybe the concern is the eagle feathers?  This is going back a while, but I thought those were awarded for bravery/courage?  So yes, it's a part of headdress, but would it not be almost like a less-extreme form of Stolen Valour?
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Offline Remius

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2016, 14:44:57 »
Some context I guess:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/aboriginal/behind-first-nations-headdresses-1.3506224

So it seems, headdress is earned or gifted.

People are upset the way we get upset when people who haven't earned medals or the right to wear our uniform do that.  I look at it from that context.

Offensive?  maybe to some, certainly inappropriate.   
Optio

Offline Lightguns

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2016, 15:45:11 »
The headdress in question is not even a part of Eastern woodland Native culture.  It's a device of plains natives.  It's like Scots complaining about the English playing Scottish bagpipes.

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2016, 15:54:05 »
The headdress in question is not even a part of Eastern woodland Native culture.  It's a device of plains natives.  It's like Scots complaining about the English playing Scottish bagpipes.
It could also be like a Canadian complaining about another Canadian wearing a foreign, but un-earned, medal on a uniform -- where the medal comes from doesn't matter as much as the "unearned honour" element.
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Offline Lightguns

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2016, 15:56:06 »
Agree, but if the kids wore paper VCs on Remembrance Day, would you melt down? 

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Offline Remius

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2016, 16:02:37 »
The headdress in question is not even a part of Eastern woodland Native culture.  It's a device of plains natives.  It's like Scots complaining about the English playing Scottish bagpipes.

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Considering that it was likely bought at the dollar store, it does have some semblance to certain Eastern headdress.  Mikmac, Ojibwa and some Algonquin. and even if it isn't then maybe the teacher should educate herself a bit more if she's going to teach something.

Still innapropriate. 
Optio

Offline Brad Sallows

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2016, 16:28:51 »
There's no shortage of items a person might wear that have some sort of cultural significance to some group, and no list of the subset of those items which should not be worn.

Do real cowpokes have a point if they demand all non-cowpokes cease wearing western garb meant to convey the image of a cowpoke?

Should a reasonable person assume faux-lumberjack is insulting to people who do work in the wilds?

Is any use of a cross or fish, or humorous modification of either, taboo to all non-Christians?
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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2016, 16:38:27 »
As long as the Teacher isn't trying to pass themself off as "xxx" and is just wearing a costume or piece thereof from "xxx" for educational purposes and is being respectful,  it's no different than a re-enactor or actor playing a role in costume.  Special interest groups and folks need to be less thin skinned, not everyone is out to get them culturally.
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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2016, 16:40:49 »
Agree, but if the kids wore paper VCs on Remembrance Day, would you melt down? 
Good point.  Me?  Not so much.  Others' mileage may vary, though.
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Offline mariomike

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2016, 16:47:40 »
,  it's no different than a re-enactor or actor playing a role in costume. 

Like finding out Iron Eyes Cody wasn't * , or that James Caan aka Sonny C. isn't actually Italian?

* Native American name controversy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Native_American_name_controversy#.22Indian.22_and_.22American_Indian.22_.28since_1492.29

Do real cowpokes have a point if they demand all non-cowpokes cease wearing western garb meant to convey the image of a cowpoke?

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« Last Edit: August 31, 2016, 00:08:42 by mariomike »
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Offline Lightguns

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #12 on: August 30, 2016, 16:49:47 »
Good point.  Me?  Not so much.  Others' mileage may vary, though.
Concur, thus the outrage.  First Nations have a numbers of issues to conquer but paper cut outs ain't one of them.  Now I am off to mount a scope on an inline, 60 days to deer season.

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Offline Bird_Gunner45

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #13 on: August 30, 2016, 18:39:57 »
As long as the Teacher isn't trying to pass themself off as "xxx" and is just wearing a costume or piece thereof from "xxx" for educational purposes and is being respectful,  it's no different than a re-enactor or actor playing a role in costume.  Special interest groups and folks need to be less thin skinned, not everyone is out to get them culturally.

I think part of the problem that some may have is that not all native cultures wear the same garments. So a, presumably white, person wearing the wrong native garb would be akin to a native teaching a class on German culture wearing a kilt and being like, "who cares? You're all the same" We tend to group all natives together in spite of cultural and linguistic differences.

On the flip side, if the teacher's heart was in the right place than it really shouldn't be a huge deal. could be used as more of a teaching experience than a cultural appropriate one.

« Last Edit: August 30, 2016, 20:03:27 by Bird_Gunner45 »

Offline Remius

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #14 on: August 30, 2016, 19:08:01 »
Concur, thus the outrage.  First Nations have a numbers of issues to conquer but paper cut outs ain't one of them.  Now I am off to mount a scope on an inline, 60 days to deer season.

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Agreed.  I would suggest that proper education for Canadians about Aboriginal history, culture etc. is one of those issue to conquer though.
Optio

Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #15 on: August 30, 2016, 19:41:15 »
First Nations aren't exactly promoting themselves very well in the social spotlight. Shouldn't they appreciate these kids are being introduced to something interesting fun and cultural (even if it's not 100% accurate) rather than what they'll probably pick up on in the news about whats going on in reservations?

I'm pretty sure I've seen plastic toy police badges and military medals.  The in thing is to go around being offended and outraged, we must be getting close to remembrance day.
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Offline Larry Strong

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #16 on: August 30, 2016, 20:16:49 »
It would appear she is a bit of a rabble rouser.......

".....It’s not the first time Dorner has complained about activities at the school....."

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/inappropriate-indigenous-costumes-worn-by-teachers-at-montreal-area-school-raise-parents-ire



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Offline MCG

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #17 on: September 04, 2016, 13:19:14 »
Angus Ried just published some interesting findings on Canadian thoughts toward political correctness, including some contrasts that set Canadian's apart from our US neighbours.

Majority of Canadians say political correctness has “gone too far” ... but we self-censor anyway.

Offline Thucydides

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #18 on: September 10, 2016, 21:36:30 »
The ENTIRE point of Political Correctness is to promote self censorship and to take various ideas off the table of discussion in the public forum. This is far softer and gentler than using Newspeak and a ruthless Thought Police as described in 1984, but equally pernicious and sadly quite effective.

Want to stop a discussion on a topic? Call the speaker "racist" or accuse them of "xxxphobia". Unless they are totally fearless, have massive internal resources to survive political, social and even economic attack on their person or are card carrying members of the "alt-right" (who's watchwords are "bring it" and brush off accusations of racism and xxxpjobia with "I don't care" and continue speaking), most polite and normal people will stop for fear of being thought of as racist/phobic etc. or the fear of facing reprisals socially and at work.

Sad to say that it takes a man like Donald Trump to smash the walls of Political Correctness or some of the foaming mouthed members of the Alt Right to carry the banner of free speech, but it also shows how deeply entrenched the idea has become, and how much "firepower" it will need to overthrow the idea of PC censorship of speech, thought and ideas in our culture and society.
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Offline George Wallace

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #19 on: October 06, 2016, 21:58:16 »
Seriously?  This is really BS.  Political Correctness will mean the death of us yet.  The Ontario Liberals are proving themselves to be wack jobs out destroy the province.  Don't take this as being Islamophobic, but more a question of wtf are they thinking and what consideration have they given to other religions, ethnic minorities, etc. and where will it all stop?


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October declared Islamic Heritage Month in Ontario


The Canadian Press
Published Thursday, October 6, 2016 2:44PM EDT

TORONTO -- October will now officially be recognized as Islamic Heritage Month in Ontario after the legislature unanimously passed an act Thursday.

It began as an NDP private members' bill, and party leader Andrea Horwath says it's an opportunity to celebrate and learn about the history of Islamic culture.

Horwath says she also hopes it's also a step toward eliminating Islamophobia, noting that in her city of Hamilton, a fire was set at a mosque recently.

Canadian Islamic History Month has been officially recognized federally since 2007.
Fareen Khan, with the International Development and Relief Organization, joined Horwath at the legislature and says it's important to profile and highlight the positive contributions of Muslims.

The news comes as Mirza Masroor Ahmad, the current and fifth caliph and leader of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, is slated to be in Toronto on Friday for a three-day Islamic convention.

He'll deliver a sermon to thousands of attendees representing more than 20 countries, and to Muslims worldwide via the global satellite TV network Muslim Television Ahmadiyya.



More on LINK.


There are only twelve (12) months in a year.  There are far more than twelve (12) religions practiced in Canada.
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Offline AbdullahD

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #20 on: October 06, 2016, 22:11:42 »
Seriously?  This is really BS.  Political Correctness will mean the death of us yet.  The Ontario Liberals are proving themselves to be wack jobs out destroy the province.  Don't take this as being Islamophobic, but more a question of wtf are they thinking and what consideration have they given to other religions, ethnic minorities, etc. and where will it all stop?


Reproduced under the Fair Dealings provisions of the Copyright Act.

More on LINK.


There are only twelve (12) months in a year.  There are far more than twelve (12) religions practiced in Canada.

Ya know George, I kind of have to agree with you. Treat all religions equally should be what is done, I see the good in this but I also recognize the stupidity in it as well.

I am an advocate for a fair and balanced representation of all religions, but you are right. More then 12 religions exist in Canada, so what makes Islam so special? What about Judaism and the issues around Israel?  Sikhs and the religious cleansing they faced in India? Etc etc etc

This is a good thing, I think, in the long run... but we must give equal treatment to all other religious groups in Canada too... pandering to much to any one group, is a sure way to shoot yourself in the foot. Canada has no extreme or rampant Islamophobia issues. Issues do exist, yes, but the general population of Canada is not bigoted or hateful? Whatever the right word is. But issues do exist sadly, but that is always the case a miniscule percent of the population always hates for no reason.

Anyways I think I am more with you on this issue, then against you. But I suspect this is somehow helping with votes. I cant trust politicians lol

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Offline George Wallace

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #21 on: October 06, 2016, 22:27:44 »
. But I suspect this is somehow helping with votes. I cant trust politicians lol

Abdullah

I think when it comes down to it, that is what it is all about; "Vote Buying".

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #22 on: October 06, 2016, 23:28:43 »
Seriously?  This is really BS.  Political Correctness will mean the death of us yet.  The Ontario Liberals are proving themselves to be wack jobs out destroy the province.  Don't take this as being Islamophobic, but more a question of wtf are they thinking and what consideration have they given to other religions, ethnic minorities, etc. and where will it all stop?

Ummm....publicly funded Catholic schools?  Does that ring a bell?
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Offline AbdullahD

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #23 on: October 06, 2016, 23:40:16 »
Ummm....publicly funded Catholic schools?  Does that ring a bell?

I know that the government in part subsidizes almost all schools in the 1-12 range. The private Islamic/Christian/Sikh schools I know of all recieve similar funding, in this day an age.

The mistakes or actions of yesteryear I am personally not counting.
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Offline Thucydides

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Re: Political Correctness
« Reply #24 on: October 07, 2016, 00:33:25 »
I know that the government in part subsidizes almost all schools in the 1-12 range. The private Islamic/Christian/Sikh schools I know of all recieve similar funding, in this day an age.

The mistakes or actions of yesteryear I am personally not counting.

I am personally not aware of religious schools outside of Catholic schools which receive public funding here in Ontario, and know for certain (having educated my children in private schools for as long as I could afford to) that Montessori and other schools do not receive any government funding whatsoever. Catholic schools receive public funding as a historical artifact, not through any decision or choice of this government at any rate.
Dagny, this is not a battle over material goods. It's a moral crisis, the greatest the world has ever faced and the last. Our age is the climax of centuries of evil. We must put an end to it, once and for all, or perish - we, the men of the mind. It was our own guilt. We produced the wealth of the world - but we let our enemies write its moral code.