SHOPPING DAY

[BinRat55]

We do the "shopping day" thing here on the rock, but maybe for a different reason. As we are a semi-isolated post, a lot of people travel 300km into St. John's do do a lot of shopping for the holidays. The travel time there and back is roughly a day's drive, given the Wx conditions usually found here. No one wants to travel at night (i don't blame them, what with all the mooses...) so a Friday is usually given for a shopping day. There's not much to choose from here...

For the record though, I'm against shopping days in bigger cities. Lots of choice, and time to choose. Canada doesn't pay me to shop... well, for myself anyway...

 

[PMedMoe]

We do the "shopping day" thing here on the rock, but maybe for a different reason. As we are a semi-isolated post, a lot of people travel 300km into St. John's do do a lot of shopping for the holidays. The travel time there and back is roughly a day's drive, given the Wx conditions usually found here. No one wants to travel at night (i don't blame them, what with all the mooses...) so a Friday is usually given for a shopping day. There's not much to choose from here...

For the record though, I'm against shopping days in bigger cities. Lots of choice, and time to choose.

So you advocate penalizing people for where they are posted?  Nice.  :  That's as bad as giving a shopping day only to people who celebrate the holiday.

The last time I got a "shopping" day was in Greenwood, back in '87. 

I'm quite satisfied with the short and special we get.

 

[armyvern]

So you advocate penalizing people for where they are posted?  Nice.  :  That's as bad as giving a shopping day only to people who celebrate the holiday.

The last time I got a "shopping" day was in Greenwood, back in '87. 

I'm quite satisfied with the short and special we get.

I'm thinking that his statement may just explain the origins of this "shopping day" ...

Perhaps, way back when the CF actually existed in small-town Canada and was thus visible to her population, with all her little radar stations, installations and outposts in the far reaches --- this "shopping day" was a way of ensuring that that those members that didn't happy to be so lucky as you to be posted near any inhabited area were afford the opportunity to ensure their families got gifts at Christams too (which obviously STILL has to be done by travelling some great distances for some members of the CF) - something that the rest of us take for granted as being easily accesable - and thus not necessary.

Don't be too harsh - it could very well be you in that isolated position ... and, like most, you'd more than likely appreciate the opportunity to have a slider (vice annual) if it took you two days travel time in order to effect this as a result of where the CF happened to posted you to.

There ARE exceptions to everything ... and his scenario seems pretty valid to me ... and fair.

 

[geo]

... Shopping days... COs "shorts"....

Call it by any other name... it's still a "short"

 

[PMedMoe]

Well, I have been in the "isolated" posting (Gander '89-'91).

I agree with you, to a point.  Some people have chosen their postings and others are posted wherever they are told to go.  Yes, I happen to be in a large city, certainly not by choice (it definitely wasn't my choice to go IR either).

Before anyone says "Suck it up!", I'm not complaining (not really  ), I'm just for equal treatment of personnel.  If everyone at that "isolated" posting gets a shopping day, great!

I spent too much time on taskings where we had to work holidays and missed Bde stand downs and never got compensated for those days.  Not that I cared about not getting them, but everyone else in my Unit who wasn't tasked, did get them.  Fair's fair, right?

 

[George Wallace]

..........  Fair's fair, right?

;D

Since when was "Life" fair?

;D

 

[PMedMoe]

;D

Since when was "Life" fair?

;D

Not since I was about two years old...... :'(   

 

[CountDC]

interesting comments - and I can actually see everyones point of view, which is scary.

Spent almost all my time in Halifax and everywhere I worked gave a shopping day to those that celebrated Christmas so a bit surprised to see someone say they never got it there.

Shopping days are totally up to the COC to give or not same as sliders on Fridays. I have no problem giving an afternoon to someone as I know how hard it can be to shop with kids in tow.  Kind of hard to hide things from them when they are with you.  Of course it is a reward for your staff doing a good job and having the work done so it should not be assumed that it will happen. 24 hour stores are great but if you have a bunch of young ones it's kind of hard to shop at 2 in the morning so I don't consider that a factor when deciding to reward a day.  I base rewards on performance - you work hard, put in the extra effort, get a reasonable amount of work done in a reasonable time then I have no problem giving time off. Some people say "if all the work is done" - in my experience this never happens as there is always more work coming in and there is always something you could be doing. It's more a matter of what type of work is not done and if it's something that can either wait or someone else will do for you - PA that just came in today can wait, an emergency pay advance needs to be actioned by someone. I also go with only an afternoon, give the member choice of certain days - ie you can take Tue or Wed next week - and stipulate that it is based on them having all important items taken care of.  They must give an update on thier work, including any possible problems and their solutions, prior to leaving. if I am happy then I will dismiss them.  The key is that it is a reward to be earned and not a given (as some I have worked with felt).

 

[CountDC]

... Shopping days... COs "shorts"....

Call it by any other name... it's still a "short"

not always - sometimes it is a matter of the immediate supvr allowing a mbr of their staff leave early  - such as when I tell them to go home at 1300 hrs on a Friday or take Tue afternoon as a shopping day.

 

[BinRat55]

So you advocate penalizing people for where they are posted?  Nice.  :  That's as bad as giving a shopping day only to people who celebrate the holiday.

The last time I got a "shopping" day was in Greenwood, back in '87. 

I'm quite satisfied with the short and special we get.

No, it's not about penalizing anyone. It's not about rewarding anyone in our case, either - it's about safety and what's actually available. When I said I was against shopping days, I meant it. We call it a shopping day here in Gander, but I can call it what ever you want - sliders, buckshee, gimmees - either way, I don't want my people on the TCH in a blizzard and driving for hours on end, rushed to get in and out, all because there is SFA here to buy. Large cities don't quite have that problem.

I'm sorry to hear that you haven't had a shopping day in so long. Maybe someday if you work for me i'll give you one... or will I??  >

 

[armyvern]

Well, I have been in the "isolated" posting (Gander '89-'91).

I agree with you, to a point.  Some people have chosen their postings and others are posted wherever they are told to go.  Yes, I happen to be in a large city, certainly not by choice (it definitely wasn't my choice to go IR either).

Before anyone says "Suck it up!", I'm not complaining (not really  ), I'm just for equal treatment of personnel.  If everyone at that "isolated" posting gets a shopping day, great!

I spent too much time on taskings where we had to work holidays and missed Bde stand downs and never got compensated for those days.  Not that I cared about not getting them, but everyone else in my Unit who wasn't tasked, did get them.  Fair's fair, right?

Given this previous statement in your other post ...

So you advocate penalizing people for where they are posted?

There's always the flip-side of the coin. I took your original post as you advocating that people posted in isolated spots ... "suck it up" themselves (ie "penalizing" for being posted to isolated locations, when it would seem to be perfectly fair and acceptable to me to authorize this given the "travel" circumstances that they are currently subject to while you currently are not).

"Equal treatment" of personnel could also go this way ...

"Well, seeing as how pers in isolated spots can only shop after a 5 hour drive due to their postings, then everyone in the CF SHALL travel a minimum of 5 hours in order to shop and will now have to ignore the 24/7 WalMart located across the street from their current residence". <--- That'd make it "fair" and everyone being treated the same too wouldn't it?

 

[PMedMoe]

When I said I was against shopping days, I meant it.

Altogether?  Your original post said you were against it in large cities.

it's about safety and what's actually available.

That's different then.  I differ from you in that I would rather be on the TCH in a snowstorm that in some cities with their idiot drivers.  :

I'm sorry to hear that you haven't had a shopping day in so long. Maybe someday if you work for me i'll give you one... or will I??  >

Gee thanks!!    I don't think we'll ever be in each others chain of command though... :-\  That's okay, as I said, I'm pretty satisfied with my time off.  Just wish we could go to a four-day week now with the drive to Kingston on weekends.....

There's always the flip-side of the coin. I took your original post as you advocating that people posted in isolated spots ... "suck it up" themselves

Then you read me wrong.  I wasn't advocating the people in isolated postings be penalized against.  (Though, to be sure, in some cases they are financially compensated for their isolation). The "Suck it up" was in regards to my comment about being on IR.  I think the whole thing is all about sematics here.  It's short, special, sliders, buckshee, whatever you want to call it.  But giving it only to people either due to their posting or their religious beliefs is discrimination, IMHO.

;D

 

[OldSolduer]

Shop on your own time. If you have to drive to a major city, so be it. We did it for three years.

 

[Michael OLeary]

This is turning into one of those threads that seems to indicates we've run out of serious topics to discuss.

Despite what it's called (short, special, sliders, buckshee, . . . .), the elephant n the room no-one wants to discuss is this:

When a service member is "300 Km" away from their home base and get into a serous vehicle accident (picture long term hospitalization), a question is eventually going to be asked about their status.  Were they on duty, were they on leave, where's the leave pass?  At that point it gets very important that someone has an official answer to that question. 

 

[George Wallace]

Shop on your own time. If you have to drive to a major city, so be it. We did it for three years.

So?  Did you have to take Leave, or did you get "bucshee"(sp) time off?  That is what this whole topic is about.

 

[George Wallace]

When a service member is "300 Km" away from their home base and get into a serous vehicle accident (picture long term hospitalization), a question is eventually going to be asked about their status.  Were they on duty, were they on leave, where's the leave pass?  At that point it gets very important that someone has an official answer to that question. 

In today's CF, this is very important, and the reason many units are having their pers fill out Lve Passes for weekends; especially if they are away on Crse.

 

[OldSolduer]

We shopped on weekends, on our own time. And with a leave pass for two days, weekend.

 

[Rodahn]

And in this day and age, everybody can shop from the comfort of their favourite armchair. As one member has stated "it ain't just for porn anymore"! ;D

 

[BinRat55]

When a service member is "300 Km" away from their home base and get into a serous vehicle accident (picture long term hospitalization), a question is eventually going to be asked about their status.  Were they on duty, were they on leave, where's the leave pass?  At that point it gets very important that someone has an official answer to that question. 

This is a very valid point - I for one have worked for Vern, and never ... NEVER want to get caught with my ass hanging in the wind... You know where the leave pass is, don't you Mike?

 

[CountDC]

This is turning into one of those threads that seems to indicates we've run out of serious topics to discuss.

to me this is a serious topic.