RNZN Protector Project" Vessels

[Kirkhill]

The 9000 tonne MRV shares some similarities with Norwegian Svalbard Icebreaker - similar size, similar concept of employment with the addition of a small transport capability but minus the heavy ice capability.

18 months from contract being signed to being in the water.  30 months from contract to delivery is anticipated.  Currently on schedule.  Vessel price (from other sources) approximately 100 MCAD.

Apparently not every capital project demands a 10 year delivery programme.

First Ship for New Zealand’s Project Protector Launched
 
 
(Source: Tenix Defence; issued Feb. 13, 2006)
 
 
The Multi-Role Vessel being built for the New Zealand Ministry of Defence by Tenix Defence was launched on the weekend at the Merwede Shipyard near Rotterdam in the Netherlands. 

Following the launch of the hull on Saturday (local time) the vessel was towed to Rotterdam, where the superstructure was lifted into place on Sunday. It will return to Merwede for fit-out. 

It is the first of a total of seven ships, including two Offshore Patrol Vessels and four Inshore Patrol Vessels, to be launched under the NZ$500m Project Protector, on schedule, 18 months after contract award. The ships will be operated by the Royal New Zealand Navy. 

Tenix Defence sub-contracted construction of the MRV to Merwede. The OPVs are being consolidated at Tenix’s yard at Williamstown in Victoria, and the IPVs are being constructed at Tenix’s yard at Whangarei in New Zealand, which is also building OPV modules. 

Merwede CEO Ton Riedtijk welcomed the NZ Secretary of Defence, Graham Fortune, the New Zealand Ambassador to The Hague, David Payton, Commodore Jack Steer RNZN, Deputy Chief of Navy, Gary Collier, MoD Project Director, Gordon Hall, MoD Project Manager, and the CEO of Tenix Defence, Robert Salteri, to the ceremony. 

Mrs Bronwyn Barton, of Melbourne, whose husband Blair is the MRV Ship Manager for Tenix Defence, launched the ship. 

Robert Salteri congratulated Merwede on its achievement, saying the MRV construction demonstrated Merwede’s versatility and excellence, and maintained the leading record of the 100-year-old shipyard. 

“The Project Protector team here in Rotterdam has set a cracking pace and a great example for the teams in Australia and New Zealand,” he said. 

The MRV will start sea trials in June, and is scheduled for delivery to Tenix Defence in the Netherlands in July. It will come to Williamstown in September for final fit-out, and will be delivered to the Ministry of Defence before the end of the year. 

The 131-metre MRV will displace approximately 9,000 tonnes and will be able to carry up to 250 troops and their equipment, a Sea Sprite helicopter, up to four additional utility helicopters as cargo, and a crew of more than 60, as well as additional trainees and Government employees. It carries two landing craft to ferry personnel and cargo to shore where there is no wharf, and is ice-strengthened. 

-ends- 

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi-bin/client/modele.pl?session=dae.16882086.1133972074.Q5cKasOa9dUAAFC2ZcA&modele=jdc_34

 

[FSTO]

Kiwis aren't as f***** as we are.  :
(sarcasm showing through)

 

[Gino]

The 9000 tonne MRV shares some similarities with Norwegian Svalbard Icebreaker - similar size, similar concept of employment with the addition of a small transport capability but minus the heavy ice capability.

18 months from contract being signed to being in the water.  30 months from contract to delivery is anticipated.  Currently on schedule.  Vessel price (from other sources) approximately 100 MCAD.

Apparently not every capital project demands a 10 year delivery programme.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi-bin/client/modele.pl?session=dae.16882086.1133972074.Q5cKasOa9dUAAFC2ZcA&modele=jdc_34

It's all well and good if you're willing to settle for a modest, off-the-shelf design that is built in a foreign shipyard.  That is, of course, politically unacceptable in Canada.  We must build and design locally at great time and expense in order to get maximum industrial benefit for Canadian firms, particularly in Quebec.  Then after the project is complete, the shipyards will go bankrupt and layoff everyone.  Then we can tool up again at phenomenal expense when it's time for a new class of ships in twenty years.  Now that's how it's done.

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Sad but true....go offshore thats the onbly way I think we will get a quality warship

 

[Cloud Cover]

Kirkhill: did you read 2 or three articles down? - USN to grow from 281 to 313 ships.

"Sufferin' Succotash." 

Cheers

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Remember when the USN was going for a 600 ship Navy, I don't believe they ever reached their goal did they?

 

[Kirkhill]

Didn't see that one Whiskey.

And yes I do remember those days Ex-Dragoon.  Reagan's build up.  Given that the number of carriers has only dropped from about 15 to 12?, that there is more emphasis on subs, amphibs, and small craft, is it the Frigates that they are short of?

Nehmind: I see they are heading still further south to 11 carriers.

 

[Cloud Cover]

Nah, the damned cold war ended too early.  ;D

IIRC, that 600 ship navy included old CF Adams destroyers and the like. [along with everything new that was planned].

I note the planned surface combatant numbers will be less than 130, or less than 10 times what Canada has right now. For a navy with the global responsibility of the USN, thats actually a pretty thin blue line. Force multipliers through advanced sensing technology and precision, long range firepower is where they are headed.

I just hope Canada can catch some of the wind in their sails!

 

[geo]

It's all well and good if you're willing to settle for a modest, off-the-shelf design that is built in a foreign shipyard.  That is, of course, politically unacceptable in Canada.  We must build and design locally at great time and expense in order to get maximum industrial benefit for Canadian firms, particularly in Quebec.  Then after the project is complete, the shipyards will go bankrupt and layoff everyone.  Then we can tool up again at phenomenal expense when it's time for a new class of ships in twenty years.  Now that's how it's done.

Gino
Lead contractor for the CFP was Irving.... New Brunswick I believe.
If memory serves me right - he was downright stingy with handing out sub contracts to Quebec shipyards.

BC & Ontario also got contracts getween Destroyers, Frigates and the Maritime patrol vessels...- so leave the Provincial whacking for another day if you don't mind.

 

[geo]

It would appear that NewZeland has chosen to give it's defense dollars to Europe instead of encouraging New Zeland and Aussie shipyards.....

Commendable.

Between the purchase of LAVs and the rest, the Kiwis have made a conscious decision not to encourage domestic R&D or local industry .... penny wise

 

[Neill McKay]

Sad but true....go offshore thats the onbly way I think we will get a quality warship

Why do you say that?  Just the cost, or do you have concerns about the quality of Canadian shipyards?

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Look at the 3 CPFs built in Quebec, the problems the 12 MCDVs have had, not to mention what seems to be the lack of work done on the Preserver in her last refit.

The CPFs when offered for export were overpriced pure and simple. Had Irving not been greedy I have no doubts there would be a few Halifax class frigates in other navies.

 

[Kirkhill]

A question for those in the know:

Let's set aside the federal government and the Irving's/Davie issues for a moment - it has been something like 10-12 years since those yards had any major projects so I am guessing that whatever hands might be available could be a little rusty on skills.

Here in BC we have yards that in 1993/1994 built two 400 car, 2000 passenger, 18,000 tonne ferries.  That might put them in the running for these type of vessels and the transports.  However today BC Ferries has sent its contracts to Germany because they lack confidence in the BC yards and pricing and financing was better.  They have suggested that the BC yards might get some of the smaller vessels they are planning over the next 15 years.

Here's the question - are the yards up to the game or did the diversion to those aluminum Cats do so much damage to available craftsmen, to changing skills and ultimately to reputation that they are some years behind the curve now?

 

[Neill McKay]

Here's the question - are the yards up to the game or did the diversion to those aluminum Cats do so much damage to available craftsmen, to changing skills and ultimately to reputation that they are some years behind the curve now?

Compared to other countries, Canadian shipyards are very expensive.  I know of one case in which a ferry (not the BC Ferries project) was priced by several domestic and foreign yards, and even with the considerable import duty on foreign-built ships, it was still cheaper to go offshore (to the Netherlands, in this case).  A couple of issues are subsidies to foreign shipyards by their governments, and the cost of labour.

BC Ferries has a similar experience with shipyard costs, and ended up going to Germany for the Super-C ferries.

 

[geo]

BTW.... where did the "cats" end up?
bought at auction by undisclosed party and were hauled down to some place on the US West coast..... then what?

 

[Gino]

Gino
Lead contractor for the CFP was Irving.... New Brunswick I believe.
If memory serves me right - he was downright stingy with handing out sub contracts to Quebec shipyards.

BC & Ontario also got contracts getween Destroyers, Frigates and the Maritime patrol vessels...- so leave the Provincial whacking for another day if you don't mind.

So remind me again why three had to be built in Quebec when Irving was awarded the contract?  Sure some other areas ended up with minor subcontracts, but also remind me where Paramax was located?  I'm not province bashing, just stating the reality of Canadian politics.

 

[Gunnerlove]

The problem with Canadian shipyards is not so much in the workers as the purchasers. It is not a matter of starting production and delivering a ship every year to replace ships as they reach the end of their service lives. Instead we order a large batch of ships to be delivered in a short period of time. This requires a number of ships to be under construction at the same time. What this does is create a boom and bust in the industry, large amounts of work appear in different parts of the country creating local skilled labour shortages. Then the work is gone and the shipyard has to lay off most of its employees as they go back to surviving off of maintenance contracts. It is hard to justify large investments in your infrastructure when you might not see another large shipbuilding contract in decades. This forces the companies to re-tool at large cost if they win a contract, the cost of the re-tooling is pushed down to consumer, "US".

If we as a country were to let a contract requiring a Frigate to be delivered every two years for 12 units a small ship yard could be established to efficiently build them one after another. They would be able to establish an adequate skilled labour force and work out the kinks in production as the project progressed. Rust out would not become a crisis issue as it currently does as we would be replacing our fleet in a protracted manner instead of as a panic purchase. As an added bonus we would be able to find the flaws in the ships before they are all built and delivered.


Hey or we could just have them built by a crown corp in the same manner.

 

[Kirkhill]

Practice makes perfect.  Or put another way, the most valuable asset that a company has is its record of mistakes and the corporate knowledge of how they were fixed. As we all seem to recognize that demands continuity.

I wonder if there is some sort of strategy in the pipeline somewhere.  You lot need the kit now but it would be nice to have our own industrial base.  As Geo points out there are advantages to keeping the dollars at home even if they are inflated dollars.  As long as DND gets the necessary funds or the IRB dollars are delivered from some other department.

 

[cobbler]

Sad but true....go offshore thats the onbly way I think we will get a quality warship

Well the NZ ship is built to commercial, not military standards. Saves cost, build time whilst sacrificing quality, safety, and its usefullness in war.
I dont think its the smartest way to go, but then again the NZDF and the RNZN in particular is in a terminal nose-dive.

It would appear that NewZeland has chosen to give it's defense dollars to Europe instead of encouraging New Zeland and Aussie shipyards.....

Commendable.

Not exactly, most of their 'project protector' ships are being built in Aus by Tenix, and some in NZ. This MRV is the only euro built, and she is only being built there because Aussie company tenix could not build her due to lack of facilities. But the deal with the shipbuilder was done through tenix.

 

[geo]

So remind me again why three had to be built in Quebec when Irving was awarded the contract?  Sure some other areas ended up with minor subcontracts, but also remind me where Paramax was located?  I'm not province bashing, just stating the reality of Canadian politics.

Three out of how many?

Paramax, what was formerly known as SPAR Aerospace.... after the success of the Canadaarm and some successful telecom satalites, I would venture to say that they were a competent agency to consider when looking at Bidds for the Org that would put the brains into the Frigates.

If you talk to our American friends, many will point out that a lot of the technological & scientific advances that the public benefit from today are derivatives of research & development made in the Space and Military fields.... Should Canada deny itself the oportunity to develop new technology - I don't think so.... but, as has been pointed out, there is no reason for this Famine / Feeding frenzy procurement system... The CF should be taking delivery of Trucks, ships, aircraft and everything else on an ongoing basis.