RCMP union bid headed to Supreme Court

[Slim]

I know that we have some members of the force on this site so I thought I'd throw this up when I saw it.

Sat, January 29, 2005


Bill would help unionize RCMP


By BILL RODGERS, OTTAWA BUREAU CHIEF

http://www.canoe.ca/NewsStand/TorontoSun/News/2005/01/29/913667-sun.html

RANK-AND-FILE Mounties will take another stab at getting their own union. Canada's national police force has been prevented from unionizing by the federal government, but a Conservative senator will introduce a bill next week that would open the door to an organizing drive.

Pierre Claude Nolin says his bill would "radically modernize" labour relations for RCMP officers by allowing them, for the first time in the history of the storied force, to vote on certifying a police association to represent them in collective bargaining.

It would also reform the RCMP Act governing grievances and disciplinary action to make the process more impartial and independent.

Canadians, however, wouldn't see the more than 13,000 Mounties manning the picket lines in a contract dispute. Nolin's bill does not give them the right to strike. A deadlock in contract bargaining would be settled by compulsory arbitration.

This is not the first time Nolin has tried to pass a bill on the issue. An attempt in 2003 failed when the Liberal government prorogued Parliament.

 

[armyvern]

Figured this was as good a place as any to place this:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2009/04/07/rcmp-union-court-ontario007.html

Mounties win right to form union
Last Updated: Tuesday, April 7, 2009 | 11:53 AM ET CBC News
An Ontario court has struck down a section of the RCMP Act, clearing the way for the country's 22,000 Mounties to form a union.

Ontario Superior Court Justice Ian MacDonnell said the section of the act that precludes unionization is unconstitutional, "because it substantially interferes with the freedom of members of the RCMP to engage in collective bargaining."

However, the decision will not take effect for 18 months, to give federal government time to consider an "appropriate response," MacDonnell said in a 38-page ruling issued Monday.

The lawsuit was launched by the Mounted Police Association of Ontario.

Currently, labour relations within the force are handled by an internal staff relations representative program. Individual members speak with staff relations representatives (SRRs), who then consult with RCMP management, where the final decision rests.

The RCMP argued that members, through their consultations with SRRs "make an invaluable contribution to the effectiveness of management's decisions."

Justice MacDonnell said he believes the collaborations between SRRs and management are "extensive and carried out in good faith," but they remain "a process of consultation only."

He characterized the staff relations program as an "entity created by management to avoid unionization."

The right to strike is not an issue as most police organizations give up that right.

Feel free to delete my post if it's already on the boards ... computer is being very sloooooooow, I could have missed it's being posted already.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Anymore news on this?

 

[mariomike]

Anymore news on this?

National Post · Sept. 28, 2010
"Court grants stay on RCMP labour case:
The Ontario Court of Appeal gave something to both sides yesterday in an ongoing legal dispute over the right of RCMP officers to form a union.":
http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/toronto/Court+grants+stay+RCMP+labour+case/3588347/story.html

 

[PuckChaser]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/rcmp-officers-bring-union-bid-to-supreme-court-1.2542183

RCMP officers bring union bid to Supreme Court

The Canadian Press

RCMP members are before the Supreme Court of Canada making a final pitch for their right to form an independent union.

They are appealing an Ontario Court of Appeal decision which found that federal labour laws which exclude RCMP members from collective bargaining do not violate the Charter of Rights.

RCMP regulations provide for elected staff-relations representatives who are to be consulted on staff and pay issues.

The Mounted Police Professional Association of Canada says that's not good enough and has been fighting for the right to collective bargaining.

The association won a victory in the Ontario Superior Court of Justice in 2009, but that was overturned on appeal in 2012.

There are about 18,000 uniformed Mounties in the national force.

It will be interesting to see the outcome of this. I always thought it was odd that every other police force in the country had a union, yet the RCMP does not.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

And it likely won't be long until someone extrapolates it to the CAF.

 

[Old Sweat]

PSAC tried it in the early seventies when Jadex was CDS. It collapsed when it became evident there could not be collective bargaining and the right to strike and all that the union really was interested in was collecting union dues from us.

 

[dapaterson]

And we already pay mess dues for no reason.  Why add union dues as well?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

PSAC tried it in the early seventies when Jadex was CDS. It collapsed when it became evident there could not be collective bargaining and the right to strike and all that the union really was interested in was collecting union dues from us.

OS, I was there then also and well remember it. In the end, lots of brouhaha for nothing.

And we already pay mess dues for no reason.  Why add union dues as well?

I'm not debating anything. I only speculated that someone, not cognizant of our past encounter with this (see above), would think it a swell idea.

I am not the person likely to advocate for this anyway, for a couple of obvious reasons.

 

[dapaterson]

I am not the person likely to advocate for this anyway, for a couple of obvious reasons.

Your shy and retiring nature?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Your shy and retiring nature?

That too 8)

 

[Hisoyaki]

In Montreal, the SPVM has a union. When they go on strike they wear fake camo pants.

http://schmlloyd.blogspot.ca/2008/11/police-strike-camouflage-pants.html

It looks absolutely ridiculous and it simply sends the wrong message to the public. There should be no unions for police.

 

[yoman]

In Montreal, the SPVM has a union. When they go on strike they wear fake camo pants.

http://schmlloyd.blogspot.ca/2008/11/police-strike-camouflage-pants.html

It looks absolutely ridiculous and it simply sends the wrong message to the public. There should be no unions for police.

Is your argument that because the members of one particular union choose to wear camo pants while on "strike" all police unions are bad? Granted, I know of other police unions in Quebec that have in the past encouraged their members to do the same but that is not a reflection of the majority of the police forces in Canada.

If a police association wishes to negotiate on behalf of its members without the general public seeing (literally) any difference than what's the harm?

 

[Retired AF Guy]

It will be interesting to see the outcome of this. I always thought
it was odd that every other police force in the country had a union, yet the RCMP does not.

Not sure about the rest of Canada, but my understanding is that no police force in Ontario
has a union; they, instead have a "association"

 

[Occam]

Not sure about the rest of Canada, but my understanding is that no police force in Ontario
has a union; they, instead have a "association"

You'd be correct.  The Ontario Labour Relations Act, which sets out the rules for trade unions, specifically excludes members of a police force within the meaning of the Police Services Act.  Same goes for firefighters.  That exclusion prohibits them from forming a union.

 

[brihard]

I'm personally not on side with the RCMP unionizing... Unions, IMHO, are more liekly to protect 'bad' employees, which is the exact opposite of what the public expects of its police forces right now. I don't beleive that a union could objectively carry out its function- the populist nature of a union coupled with 'old school' attitudes still present in policing would, I believe, hinder necessary reforms. Sernior police leadership should maintain an ability similar tot he military to enforce discipline internally in ways that are unlike other civilian occupations. The RCMP already has a generally pretty effective staff relations organization with elected representatives. I (perhaps cynically) think there's a bit too much of a 'hard done by' mentality amongst those pushing for a union that comes more from a civilian mindset than one suited for an organization that has to be so very accountable to the public. Police are uniquely empowered, and are very well compensated for it. I'm concerned that a union would push the needs of the members above the needs of the organization and through it the public.

That's just my $.02, obviously heavily biased from a military background...

 

[mariomike]

Update

January 16, 2015

"Historic SCC Decision Allows RCMP Members Collective Bargaining"
http://mppac.ca/historic-scc-decision-allows-rcmp-members-collective-bargaining/

 

[OldSolduer]

Not sure about the rest of Canada, but my understanding is that no police force in Ontario
has a union; they, instead have a "association"

Thats true for the Winnipeg Police Service.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Not sure about the rest of Canada, but my understanding is that no police force in Ontario
has a union; they, instead have a "association"

A rose, by any other name, is still a rose.

 

[ModlrMike]

A rose, by any other name, is still a rose.

In MB, by law if you conduct union like activities you are a union regardless of what you call yourself.