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PSAC Strike Actions and Some Reactions- Merged Thread

bossdog

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Another strike started today with one of the civilian unions that represent personnel that work on base.

It seems that it is pretty harmless aside from holding up traffic for 15 to 30 minutes but what are your views on the matter?

Here are some good points that came up at work today:

- Our pay increase will be formulated on their results;
- We give up some of our rights and freedoms to defend their right to protest and therefore should not obstruct our role on base;
- It is their legal right;
- <EDIT>If it weren't for the military, you wouldn't even have this job, be happy that you're working.
- If you aren't happy with your pay or job, quit.

I'm on the fence with this hole issue. It seems to be pretty quiet so far but I have seen protests on base that have gotten out of hand.
 
Yeah, one of our messes here in Borden closed down today because of the strike and we had to march over to the other one 20 min away.  But other than that, we are not too inconvenienced.  And as you said, if the civilians get a pay raise, we'll get one too.  But hell, I'm still waiting to see the money from the pay raise that was supposed to start back in April.  When will that actually kick in?
 
That's the one we're waiting for. Hopefully we get it shortly after the strike is over.

I was in Borden yesterday for the first time in 8 years! There was a lot of changes and I can't beleive how much the town of Alliston has grown!
 
The pay raise you're talking about is the one that will reflect the outcome of the current strikes.  We knew back when that CANFORGEN was issued that these strikes could happen since a number of CBA's expired this fall and the actual amount of the pay raise would be dependant on what the PSAC gets.

It is their legal right, however, they cannot stop you from going to work, maybe slow you down but not stop you.  We've been instructed here in Shearwater to show up for work in uniform with a valid Mil ID and there shouldn't be any problems. If it's official business that needs to be done be it a dental appointment or a scheduled flight or whatever the case may be, they have to let you through. Keep in mind that although it may be a pain in the arse, most of these people don't get incentives like we do every year and the only way to get a raise is to take strike action. In a lot of cases we work very closely with them on a day to day basis so it's in your best interest to be cordial to them and just show up for work 30min early, after all the Queen doesn't pay you to work 8-4, she pays you to get the job done. IIRC, DND has already settled with our employees, but since they all belong to PSAC, they all strike.

Cheers
 
I've been trying to understand this strike.

Does anyone have some more definitive information on it?
I've got classes at the maritime warfare center at Stadacona and they keep telling us to show up early but there's never any strikers.
 
whiskey 601 said:
KTJ, would that be a fence post hole?   ;D

It could very well be a fence post hole that I'm stuck in.

On one side I'm thinking "good for you, get all the money you can and exercise your rights and freedoms". Afterall, this will benefit us (the military) in the long run. :salute:

On the other side, I have a little screaming voice in the back of my head that says "Put up & shut up or get the hell out. If you don't like your job, for whatever reason, piss off and find a new one." I think this voice is the army in me that's just lashing out. :threat:
 
Isn't it ironic?

We were just talking about this yesterday in our lines. I mentioned that I noticed the irony of their (the civvie strikers) actions. Although they are exercising guaranteed rights and freedoms they have decided once again (as they always have) to picket the entrances to our base. What this accomplishes is inconvenience us (the soldiers), possibly making us late for roll call or other timings. Someone mentioned leaving 20-30 minutes earlier. Yes, this will solve it. For those who need to drop off children at daycare centers (with set hours of operation) this is not an option.

However, they are inconveniencing the very people who are the most powerless to change policy regarding their grievances. It is not the soldiers sailors and airmen (officers included) who will get them their raises and other whinges sorted out. In fact, the ones that they are delaying are the very ones who have given up many rights and freedoms so they, the strikers, can exercise their rights and freedoms. We often do twice the work of civilian, draw half the pay (no union). I however, do not have the right or freedom to strike. I have enough of a sense of humour to see the irony here.
 
I have enough of a sense of humour to see the irony here.

Hey PadraigyVagon! Why don't try and take some of that sense of humour with you to work so we can improve the quality of atmosphere here in our cell...since we don't have a union...you lil' piss ant!   :blotto: ;)
 
Padraig OCinnead said:
Isn't it ironic?

However, they are inconveniencing the very people who are the most powerless to change policy regarding their grievances. It is not the soldiers sailors and airmen (officers included) who will get them their raises and other whinges sorted out. In fact, the ones that they are delaying are the very ones who have given up many rights and freedoms so they, the strikers, can exercise their rights and freedoms. We often do twice the work of civilian, draw half the pay (no union). I however, do not have the right or freedom to strike. I have enough of a sense of humour to see the irony here.

They are inconveniencing many others as well.   Petawawa had 20 Km line ups in traffic from the Gate to Hwy 41 on the Trans Canada Hwy in Pembroke.   There was a 20 Km line up to Chalk River to the West as well.   That was a serious traffic hazard on 40 Km of the Trans Canada Highway, holding up East and West bound Truckers, workers at AECL, normal commuter traffic, School buses, Vacationers, etc.   The Strikers could have been more organized and not caused the line ups to build up on a major highway.  The only organization they showed was to show up at 0645 and block the gates.  That was a MOB. 

GW
 
I think it is good that they are excercising their right to strike, but when a civie says ya well tomorrow you will appreciate us when you are standing in line waiting for your food, that makes me mad i pay for that crap, I hate it when people take their job for granted, especially people getting paid very well for the job they are doing. yes they will help us the military worker get a better pay raise but i already make good money ( can't beleive i just said that), they need to realize they could have much worse jobs with little or no job security. Be gald of your job and thankfull for the money and security.
 
Picketing is one thing.  Blocking access to various bases, as they have been doing, is both illegal and very aggravating.  They say they are not blocking access, because they let one car in every five minutes.  What BS!  If they keep it up, there will be some bitter divisions.  They also say they are doing it becasue there are too many civilians working on Bases that are not part of the Union.  People like me, the cleaners, the Commissionaires, and so on.

They obviously have a higher agenda than just pay, they want to see all civilians in the union, to broaden their power.  It iwll be a cold day in heck before I belong to any union!
 
What would you do,Lance, quit?
Remember striking isn't always about money as most of the time you don't make it back. [future employee's enjoy it though] I've been through two strikes now and I wish I never had. It was one of the "@#%$&*# gifts" that our nice NDP govt. gave to us. Before that we had binding arbritation and to me, it worked a lot better since the jails can't withdraw all our services we strike but still do the job,........ stupid!
Now our last strike had nothing to do with money it was all about our pension fund, the Harris boys wanted to take OUR money and put it in general funds of the govt. and then decide how much it might have grown over my working years.
All it was an attempt to balance the books for that year and put it on a future govts. back. Trust me, we made no money but at least we still control our pension.
Remember no one wants to be out there but this is the way it works in the civi world, just hope you never have to go through your "right" to strike. Not getting paid is not all its cracked up to be.
 
Personnally, I don't think it's helping us (members of the CF) in any way. The public service and the CF have different pay systems, and they are not connected. Even our pension systems are different. The only way we can get a pay raise in the Military is through promotions. We also have incentives, usually a negligible amount, and the annual "cost of living" adjustment usually in April. I believe the CF adjustment was decided in time for April, but the govt refused to announce it so the public service doesn't use the data in their negotiations...
We should turn as many as possible of those civilian jobs into Military positions.
 
Our pay should be linked to M.P.'s and Fed. Judges pay raises's!!
They are getting a 10% pay hike!!!
 
Bruce Monkhouse said:
Remember no one wants to be out there but this is the way it works in the civi world,

Fair enough Bruce,

But where I (and many others) have a problem with the ongoing PSAC labour dispute is when strike action has a deleterious impact upon our ability to do what we are paid to do.  It is not simply a matter of showing up late for PT because you couldn't get on base out of uniform.  When strike action begins to adversely affect the delivery of military training, we have a "no win" situation. 

My school (CTC Tactics) has 10 training days in which to deliver the Residency portion of the "Army Tactical Operations Course" starting on Monday.  Two days of the curriculm are TEWT-based, and as such are dependant upon contracted civilian coaches getting on base to pick up the students and deliver them to the TEWT site.  A further 5 days of the ATOC Residency package are JCATS (Janus) based.  If the part-time JCATS civilian employees cannot access the base due to PSAC strike action, then we cannot train.  There is no scope to "adjust" our timings, nor make-up lost training opportunities.  When strike action precludes the JCATs interactors from showing up for work on time, the only people who suffer are our military students who have travelled at great expense to attend a very regimented (and zero-flex) 10-day training program.  Who suffers?  And to what quantifiable end? Do our students have any bearing on the outcome of the Federal Government labour dispute?  Do I or my fellow military instructors?  The answer is a resounding "NO".

I am generally sympathetic to the striking PSAC workers.  I don't mind having to wait an extra 20 minutes (on a personal level) to get on base during strike action.  Where I have a fundamental problem with the strike action is when it screws with my military duties to the point of no recovery.  When my students'  training resources are unecessarily waylayed, I can no longer do my job.  That situation is manifestly unnaceptable.  It is precisely this sort of thing that turns me from a reasonably sympathetic (albeit greatly inconvenienced) bystander into a manifest hater of the sheer obstinate ignorance demonstrated by the average striker.....

The PSAC employees are entitled to strike and protest.  We all know that.  The "Defense Team" notwithstanding, I understand and appreciate their plight. But the minute a labour protest precludes me from doing my job for the benefit of Army as a whole?  Well, to say that the civiilian strikers have lost my support would be a manifest understatement.....

If PSAC wants to strike and disrupt "life" then by all means do it on Parliament Hill where the effects will be felt. There is zero to be gained by jacking around those of us who wear the uniform.  We're supposedly on the same "defence team".  Furthermore, none of us in uniform has the wherewithal to make an iota of difference in settling the labour dispute.  The only people that suffer as a result of piquet lines at a military establishment are the CF personnel and (in my case) their students. 

Quite frankly, the current situation of day by day "will they, or won't they screw us around" is ludicrous.  As much wiser minds have said in the past, "this ain't no way to run a railroad".  If PSAC keeps targetting Military members and our training-essential (but non-union employees), they are simply cutting their own throats.  My patience is already wearing VERY thin, and we've only just begun the latest charade..... 

Quite frankly, impeding access to a military establishment should be manifestly illegal.  It apparently is, but there are ludicrous loopholes which say that a "reduced flow" of 5 cars per hour is perfectly acceptable.  Bull-crap!  Screw with the learning opportunity that I am trying to afford my military students, and you have just made an enemy. 

It has only just begun, and I've already had enough of the crap.  For the PSAC employees - pick on somebody who can do something about your grievances.  Just let me do my job.  Interfere with the learning of my students, and you royally piss me off.  At that point, I am all for the "billy-club" approach....

Just my $.02.....
 
Coming from a small business owning family that has been targeted by a high power union, I don't have much sympathy for these guys either.

Perhaps we could hold Crowd-Control drills for the troops to open up the gates.
 
Don't get me wrong, I'm not a great fan of the unions who like to throw their members weight around[especially when they go against what most members actually care about...CAW anyone?] If you wish to blame someone blame the military, thats right, I'm sure if anyone higher up the food chain gave a rats *** that you guys are getting pissed off, they could have started the ball rolling a long time ago towards making them essential service and employ binding arbitration, just like you have, in a way, and I used to have in the good old days.
I find most unions, with their" everyone equal, whether incompetent or not" is slowly sucking the life out of the civil service. Its almost parallel to some of those "be nice" programs that some say are killing the military.

Back to the original topic, these people don't want to inconvenience you, but thats the weapon they have and sometimes it must be used. Here's an idea, stop and talk to them and try to work out a solution, something simple usually works like offer to honk, etc. These people are your neighbours.
 
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