Debates on Army.ca

[SHELLDRAKE!!]

I have noticed a trend with new posters and guests to Army.ca, that they begin their first post with a controversial statement with no
evidential backing, get in a p***ing match with anyone that asks for facts and is banned before their 40th post.

It is almost always included that they are being ganged up on because of their point of view or their beliefs.

Unfortunately what they don't see is that if they provided proof with their opinions, a real debate could happen.

We at Army.ca don't pick apart posts unless they are obviously statements based on no facts.Maybee these "troll's"
would be around longer if any of them could make a statement and back it with facts from somewhere other than
the tinfoil hat factory.

 

[Scott]

I have noticed a trend with new posters and guests to Army.ca, that they begin their first post with a controversial statement with no
evidential backing, get in a p***ing match with anyone that asks for facts and is banned before their 40th post.

We've been seeing this for about two months, IIRC. I think also this latest influx has something to do with the time of year. Specifically that there are many bored University students out there killing time between exams. In fact, one even admitted such in the open forums!

It is almost always included that they are being ganged up on because of their point of view or their beliefs.

Yup, we persecute them, infringe on their freedom of speech, we're fascists, ultra conservative yes-men, need I go on?

Unfortunately what they don't see is that if they provided proof with their opinions, a real debate could happen.

+ 1.

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/28552.330.html

Reply # 336 applies here as well.

We at Army.ca don't pick apart posts unless they are obviously statements based on no facts.Maybee these "troll's"
would be around longer if any of them could make a statement and back it with facts from somewhere other than
the tinfoil hat factory.

+ 1 more.

Total Members: 10437
Total Posts: 372235
Total Topics: 24311
Total Categories: 8
Users Online: 251
Most Online: 696 - 04 April 2005, 23:37:34
Online Today: 282
Total page views: 25362089

10,000 plus members and we only get a handful saying that we are big bad men picking on them. So do I lose sleep? Nope. I have the rest of the 10,000 plus who seem to enjoy this site, the way people post here, the themes and moderation just fine.

Everybody has a choice, you do not have to come to Army.ca!

Thanks Shelldrake, nice to see someone else thinking the same.

 

[mcchartman]

Specifically that there are many bored University students out there killing time between exams. In fact, one even admitted such in the open forums!

Well exams are mostly done now, so maybe you can re-post in this thread in the coming month to enlighten us as to whether, in your own humble opinion, the fact that it was exam period had any effect on the frequency of new posters making controversial statements without any facts to back them. This could prove to be interesting. Pointless, but interesting nonetheless.

...and is banned before their 40th post.

Phew. That means I am only 27 posts short of being a bored university student without being a prime target of the banning action going on. Sounds like I'm off to a good start.  8)

 

[scoutfinch]

Maintain an attitude like that and you will be lucky to see 15.

8)

 

[Scott]

Well exams are mostly done now, so maybe you can re-post in this thread in the coming month to enlighten us as to whether, in your own humble opinion, the fact that it was exam period had any effect on the frequency of new posters making controversial statements without any facts to back them. This could prove to be interesting. Pointless, but interesting nonetheless.

We've been seeing this for about two months, IIRC. I think also this latest influx has something to do with the time of year. Specifically that there are many bored University students out there killing time between exams. In fact, one even admitted such in the open forums!

Miss that the first time around? Take time to read the whole post before trying to piss people off. Pointless? Not when you have to chase these people around and clean up the messes they leave. But you knew that... :

Phew. That means I am only 27 posts short of being a bored university student without being a prime target of the banning action going on. Sounds like I'm off to a good start.  8)

What scoutfinch said.

Did you want to add anything to this thread? Or were you casting?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Did you want to add anything to this thread? Or were you casting?

Wrong kind of fishing. What he's doing is trolling, and it won't be tolerated from him after this point.

 

[17thRecceSgt]

The ones that peeve me off the most are the ones that "hijack" a thread that is very informative and well done and then they come in and let some "blast of stupidity/contraversy" go on purpose and THEN the thread just goes to putz after that...like what Artsy and CanuukTroop were doing the past week or so.  I was following one thread on Iran and the nuke thing and CanuukTroop just plain dropped a bomb on the thread.  I was following it because I have not much info on that whole situation...and it was a peeve-off to have someone run it off the rails.

Arty did it 2 nights ago too.  sigh.

Applause to the Mod's for 1) keeping an eye on things and stepping in when needed  2) creating Artsy's Wonderful World Of History the other night!  I loved it!  Still laughing at that one...particularly Franko's killerbot..."Exterminate Extermine  Kill the Doctor"....I still chuckle when I think of THAT thread.  Bravo zulu!

;D

*Stop hijacking the threads*

*If you have nothing intelligent to say...then say exactly that...NOTHING*

rant off

 

[_TheSaint_]

I have to ask though- what kind of a debate is it if there's no controversy?

Yes, many are now thinking........"here comes the troll- tinfoil hats on- someone isn't in lock step"

But really, it's not a debate if there aren't different opinions. Just because my "opinion" is different than yours does not make it less valid. Even if you believe someone's not as well informed as you on a given issue, that doesn't mean they shouldn't voice their opinion. It would be a very quiet world if no one but experts spoke on any given issue. If they're wrong, you might take that opportunity to sort them out, rather than getting all emotional. Alot of people who are supposedly "informed" really use a bunch of facts to cover up their own lack of IDEAS. Facts and Ideas are different IMO.

Alright- Flame On.

 

[_TheSaint_]

PS with this post I'm 12 over my trolling limit.

 

[Wookilar]

It's not the different opinions that get some (ok, many) of us going, it is the weasels that post and run. They also usually post utter crap that has very little basis in reality.

I do not mind a differing point of view, as you say, it is vital to having a debate. However, do not come here and tell me I am part of an oppresive regime trodding on the rights and freedoms of those less fortunate (for example). I've helped get those less fortunate out of the middle of a bloody mine field because they were trying to collect scrap. If you come to the table, bring something to contribute.

The posts vs the Winnipeg Ex were very well done (for the most part) by all concerned. A great many IDEAS were tossed around. One of the bigger problems is that we, as in the dudes on the ground, tend to be more practical in nature. Fancy ideas that depend on human beings getting together in one great group hug do not hold any real promise.

If you have any practical suggestions on how to make the world a better place, good (I would really love to watch my daughter grow up and not miss anymore bdays/anniverseries/xmas because I'm across the water). If not, please do not come in here for the express purpose of stirring up crap. We are here to learn and become more educated about places/ideas/situations that we have not been in ourselves and to pass on what we have learned. I will have a discussion with anyone, on just about anything. If you want to talk opinions, fine with me. Solutions? Even better.

Let's go.

 

[muskrat89]

PS with this post I'm 12 over my trolling limit.

Cute.

PM Inbound

 

[TCBF]

" Alot of people who are supposedly "informed" really use a bunch of facts to cover up their own lack of IDEAS. Facts and Ideas are different IMO."

- I see facts and ideas as mutually supporting.  If an idea leads to a statement, then those at odds with that idea are best served facts to support the idea, or at least sustain the relevance of the debate.  On the other hand, an idea can be used to draw out useful facts known to others. Clearly, no one has all the facts or a patent on all ideas. 

This medium is great in that it provokes us to 'write'.  Writing forces us to sort out ideas which would normally flow from our sodden wine smitten faces with no control whatsoever.  We are allowed the luxury of a sober (sorry) second thought before posting.  Mere talking is no substitute for writing when it comes to 'peer review': our comments are here for all and sundry to read and remark on. 

If we merely push ideas out the slot with no facts to support them, we lose credibility.  Once credibility is lost, debate becomes uninteresting.  Then it's back to quoting war movies.

Tom

 

[Enzo]

Quoting war movies... is that bad? :-\

 

[TCBF]

"Bomb Fuzing Master Safeties on: Electronic, Barometric, Time, and Impact."

 

[Danjanou]

And for those whining about the big bad mods slapping labels on these trolls, I direct your attention to those bastions of frees speech such as Babble or The gone but never forgotten Pike’s site. Say one thing contrary to their party line and bang, you’re posts are deleted and you’re banned over there. Yup I love that free and open exchange of ideas. I wonder what good ole George Orwell would have thought of  the Internet?

 

[George Wallace]

I wonder what good ole George Orwell would have thought of  the Internet?

Some Animals are more equal than others.

 

[HDE]

Hi Folks

   On a personal note I really appreciate the efforts of the DS to keep things focussed and tight.  I've seen other sites  quickly go downhill once the trolls showed up. 

 

[mcchartman]

It appears I have to clear things up here:

Scott: From your message, it is clear that you were taking my reply way too seriously. I am truly honest when I say that I wrote this with a grin on my face and really did not intend to shock or bash anyone. That is one problem with forums: you just don't see the expression of the person writing. When I re-read my post, I have to admit that the "in your own humble opinion" bit may easily lead one to conclude that I'm being a sarcastic a**hole but I swear that it is simply a (bad) habit of mine to overcrowd my sentences. Please keep in mind however that English is not my mother tongue and so sometimes I cannot predict with certainty how you guys will interpret what I write. I was actually inviting shelldrake to provide some feedback later on and give us his conclusions.

Recceguy: I was not attempting to lure anyone in diverting from the original topic. Don't you agree that the first post was in fact a very broad statement and that from this point, the discussion could go in pretty much any direction? I have always believed that when someone posts on a topic he is inviting the community to give feedback on his ideas and this is basically what I was doing. Sorry if my tone seemed sarcastic, but as I've explained above, it is sometimes how to predict how you guys will interpret my sentences.

That being said, I present my apologies to shelldrake and sincerely hope you will understand my position. In agreeing with him, I may have in fact perpetuated that which he was denouncing and for that I am sorry. If you feel this post does not bring anything new to the thread, please feel free to remove it, but at least until then I will have tried to clarify publicly where I stand.

 

[Scott]

Well I'll take it as a clarification and let it stand, it does serve to show people something and reinforce statements from the Army.ca Conduct Guidelines, such as:

You are responsible for everything that you post and the tone in which it is posted.

The above statement is in bold red in the Guidelines, guess it carries some importance ;D

mcchartman,

I guess I'm guilty of getting caught up in yesterdays influx of people looking for a fight. I lumped you in with that group and apologize for it. I ignored or forgot one of my repeated statements here: You can't discern tone through type. But I do fall back on the statement from the Guidelines - the responsibility is on all of us to make sure we read through what we are writing before mashing the post button.

Regardless, I think you understand the point and have made amends for any misinterpretation, good on you for that. + 1. So many others would simply hit the flame button and fire away, thanks for not doing that.

I hope we can just say 'fair one' and continue.

 

[SHELLDRAKE!!]

Phew. That means I am only 27 posts short of being a bored university student

Understandable how an intent can be misconstrued

PS with this post I'm 12 over my trolling limit.

Now see blatent trolling