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All Things Air Defence/AA (merged)

Colin Parkinson

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That all looks very expensive, particularly at the rate of fire of the smaller autocannons. If I recall correctly, most of the current auto cannons cannot flick a switch to change ammunition type in the feed tray, it`s possible that they won't have it loaded when needed or one vehicle in a Troop would be loaded with it and dedicated to AD overwatch.
The Bofors 57mm cannon used on the ships have a very effective round and ROF to defeat antiship missiles and would likley make a good SPAAG. 57mm gives you a lot more room for fuze, shrapnel and bursting charge. 57mm Naval Gun System. Although this gun is popular with Navies, it has yet to make it's way into the ground role.
 

suffolkowner

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That all looks very expensive, particularly at the rate of fire of the smaller autocannons. If I recall correctly, most of the current auto cannons cannot flick a switch to change ammunition type in the feed tray, it`s possible that they won't have it loaded when needed or one vehicle in a Troop would be loaded with it and dedicated to AD overwatch.
The Bofors 57mm cannon used on the ships have a very effective round and ROF to defeat antiship missiles and would likley make a good SPAAG. 57mm gives you a lot more room for fuze, shrapnel and bursting charge. 57mm Naval Gun System. Although this gun is popular with Navies, it has yet to make it's way into the ground role.

The article seemed to suggest that switching between ammunition types was commonplace. Can we do this with our M242 Bushmaster?

The Bofors 57mm does seem like a natural fit, but maybe too much for LAV

"The heaviest weapon will be a Bofors medium-calibre 57mm Mk 110 Mod 0 gun which is already in service with the US and several other navies. It can deliver up to 4 rounds per second and has a range of about 17km. The whole system, including 1,000 rounds weighs around 14 tonnes. This is a very different weapon to the much heavier 114mm (4.5”) Mk 8 that delivers a single shell every 2 seconds and has equipped the majority of RN frigates since the 1970s."


but what about it's little brother, the 40mm?

"The Type 31 will not be fitted with 20mm Phalanx CIWS but instead will mount two Bofors 40mm Mk 4 guns. These lightweight 2.3-tonne, non-deck penetrating mounts can deliver 5 rounds per second out to about 12.5km and are designed to respond rapidly at a wide range of elevations. By delivering heavier shells further away from the ship the Mk 4 is superior to Phalanx in some ways. They provide defence against air and missile attack but use the same sophisticated 3P type ammunition as the 57mm so can quickly change to engage small boat or UAV threats. 100 rounds are held in the gun ready to fire with the ability to shift between different types of ammunition."

above quotes from

of course integration of the above choices would probably be more work and money versus the IM-SHORAD. I just wondered about the choice of the 30mm over the 25mm already in service
 

FJAG

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A slight tilt on calibres, I'm a fan of the Rheinmetal NBS Mantis/Millenium systems which are in 35 mm. It's not those extra five or ten millimetres but the fragmenting AHEAD ammunition with an automated fuze setter that works well as an anti-missile system. As an aside there is also a range of anti-armour projectile which will take out pretty much any APC/IFV in the inventory.

A bit much for most drones but I'm sure that that can be adapted by a fire control system and/or an accompanying smaller calibre side arm.

 

CBH99

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A slight tilt on calibres, I'm a fan of the Rheinmetal NBS Mantis/Millenium systems which are in 35 mm. It's not those extra five or ten millimetres but the fragmenting AHEAD ammunition with an automated fuze setter that works well as an anti-missile system. As an aside there is also a range of anti-armour projectile which will take out pretty much any APC/IFV in the inventory.

A bit much for most drones but I'm sure that that can be adapted by a fire control system and/or an accompanying smaller calibre side arm.

For a 35mm gun with various types of ammo available, that thing is one unbelievably nasty little gun. When it first elevated to engage an air target, I wasn't expecting it to just unleash hell like that. Looks like a great weapon to slave to a C-RAM radar over the traditional 20mm Phalanx.
 

NavyShooter

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The Ruskies seemed to think that the 57mm wasn't too big, though they used a T-54 tank chassis for theirs. Though, the ZSU-23 seems to have been their more long-standing solution.

Note, the 1000 rounds of 57mm ammo puts us on somewhat uneven terms of discussion. Yup, a naval mount having 1000 rounds (HMC Ships carry about 1800) is reasonable...the thing is at 19 pounds per cartridge, the 14 tons is mostly ammunition weight. If you took just the 120 rounds that normally fill the turret, you'd have a total system weight of 5.6 Tons. Putting another 120 rounds to double the basic load would add just over another ton.
 

Kirkhill

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A slight tilt on calibres, I'm a fan of the Rheinmetal NBS Mantis/Millenium systems which are in 35 mm. It's not those extra five or ten millimetres but the fragmenting AHEAD ammunition with an automated fuze setter that works well as an anti-missile system. As an aside there is also a range of anti-armour projectile which will take out pretty much any APC/IFV in the inventory.

A bit much for most drones but I'm sure that that can be adapted by a fire control system and/or an accompanying smaller calibre side arm.



Back to the future FJAG?






Both the Dutch and the Danes opted for a 35mm cannon (admittedly a Bushmaster instead of an Oerlikon) on their CV-90s.

Rheinmetall-Oerlikon has a lot of history on the short game.

Kongsberg's NASAM for Area Defence?

 

Kirkhill

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And while we are at it



Please tell me that the RCA GBAD/LRPFs team is talking to the RCN CSC team.

Is there any reason they can't use the same suite of missiles, cannons, and fire control? Sensors might need a bit of tweaking - maybe
 
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