Author Topic: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO  (Read 43429 times)

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Offline benny88

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They've finally put together a decent website for this program, which allows pilots to attend the University of Western Ontario and attain various flying licenses through Empire Aviation here in London. It's a great program, anyone who has further questions can PM me, or post here, there's another CAM student/grad or two floating around.


Commercial Aviation Management website: http://mos.uwo.ca/cam/

CAM and ROTP: http://empireaviation.com/web/index.php/cam/rotp

PDF from the CF recruiting site: http://64.254.158.112/pdf/CAMP_en.pdf




PS for mods- I suppose this could go in Aircrew Trades, but I feel it's more relevant here. Move it if you wish, cheers.
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Offline Redeye121

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2008, 13:24:16 »
Yeah first of all thank you for posting this. I found the links to be quite helpful. I have been looking into this program for some time now, but still have a few questions. The program as I have read is sponsored by the CF, which is a bonus. The academic part there, how good is it? I mean this by is it just a useless degree or can you actually apply it to good use say in 20-25 years after one has retired from the CF? My final question is, I am currently in Belgium and will be returning to Canada in 2009. On the Transport Canada site it tells me that there is a doctor in Belgium listed on there. Does that mean that if I went to him I wouldn't need to get another one upon arriving in Canada? I look forward to your response.

Cheers
Red

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2008, 13:31:59 »
    The degree that grads of this program hold is a BMOS (Business Management and Organizational Studies) which I think is a very good and applicable degree. In addition to standard economics, math, and business courses, you get to take cool stuff like History of Aviation in Canada, Aviation Law, and Airport Urban Planning.
   The program is quite new, so the first graduates are just percolating into the work force now, but from what I hear they are having success. The combo of a Biz degree plus specific aviation industry courses I imagine makes it fairly attractive to civilian aviation employers.
   About your Transport Canada Medical and getting it in Belgium, I wouldn't know. If he's a TransCan certified Doc, I would guess that would be fine, but I recommend calling someone at Transport Canada and asking the question there. Good luck!
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Offline Redeye121

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2008, 14:08:13 »
OK thanks for the quick reply, and helpful answers. I do agree that the program would be good especially to employers in the aviation business. As for the Transport Canada medical yeah I will have to call the guy up in the near future.

Once again thanks :)

Red

Offline militarymum

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2008, 08:05:22 »
My son has applied and been accepted to this program at UWO.  This is one of several options that he is contemplating while patiently awaiting a decision on his application to RMC.  We visited the campus during this past weekend's open house and he spoke with senior students of the program.  They were helpful in answering his questions and enthusiastic in their praise for the program as well as excited about their futures.  An ROTP student described his summer employment which was different than the non-ROTP student who worked for Transport Canada during his summers.  Currently the most senior class is small, only 8 anticipate graduating.  Attrition may be high, due to the cost or perhaps, like other flight training, very high standards with higher than average stress.  Either way, it appears that those who stick to it are happy with the program and pleased to have the hours under their belt.

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2008, 22:43:41 »
My son has applied and been accepted to this program at UWO.  This is one of several options that he is contemplating while patiently awaiting a decision on his application to RMC.  We visited the campus during this past weekend's open house and he spoke with senior students of the program.  They were helpful in answering his questions and enthusiastic in their praise for the program as well as excited about their futures.  An ROTP student described his summer employment which was different than the non-ROTP student who worked for Transport Canada during his summers.  Currently the most senior class is small, only 8 anticipate graduating.  Attrition may be high, due to the cost or perhaps, like other flight training, very high standards with higher than average stress.  Either way, it appears that those who stick to it are happy with the program and pleased to have the hours under their belt.

  Glad to hear he was accepted and that you got some good feedback from some CAM students. Fire away with any questions if I can help.
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Offline Magic

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ROTP Pilot Dilemma
« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2008, 11:34:40 »
I am faced with a possible dilemma in the ROTP pilot process. I am torn between RMC and UWO C.A.M.P program. For those who may not know the CAMP program is sponsored by the DND to train/streamline pilots into the forces through UWO.

Does anyone have any experience with UWO and this program versus RMC. Speaking pilot MOC strictly, which one would be more beneficial in the long run? From the research which I have done, you bypass BFT since you receive a Commercial License while attending school and advance to the latter part of training.

Offline George Wallace

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Re: ROTP Pilot Dilemma
« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2008, 11:42:13 »
I am faced with a possible dilemma in the ROTP pilot process. I am torn between RMC and UWO C.A.M.P program. For those who may not know the CAMP program is sponsored by the DND to train/streamline pilots into the forces through UWO.

Does anyone have any experience with UWO and this program versus RMC. Speaking pilot MOC strictly, which one would be more beneficial in the long run? From the research which I have done, you bypass BFT since you receive a Commercial License while attending school and advance to the latter part of training.

OK.  Time for you to do some research.  CAMP is a brand new program.  So new, you are probably on the very first course.  If you really want information, you should go back to your CFRC and talk to them, then do some research into UWO's program. 

Does that help?
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Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2008, 11:47:58 »
Update with a new handout relating to ROTP. This was put together by the university administration (with the help of yours truly ;)) and approved by an officer at Sudbury CFRC.
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Offline benny88

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Re: ROTP Pilot Dilemma
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2008, 11:49:09 »
You're not on the first course. Check out this thread: http://forums.army.ca/forums/index.php/topic,71815.0.html

PM me or post in that thread for CAM specific questions, there's a couple of us on this site. Cheers.
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Offline Magic

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Re: ROTP Pilot Dilemma
« Reply #10 on: December 17, 2008, 11:53:25 »
PM sent ...
« Last Edit: December 17, 2008, 12:36:58 by Magic »

Offline George Wallace

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2008, 12:36:21 »
 ::) 

Here.  Merged with a topic started by benny88 quite some time ago.  Now we have one topic, not two, and I will merge any others I find, so you won't have to do too much work.
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Offline spagyi

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2009, 09:37:30 »
My question would be about th application deadlines. I contacted CFRC Toronto, but they kept confusing me with the RMC applicants. I have done high school in Hungary, but I am a Canadian citizen, and I applied to the UWO for CAMP and got accepted. I applied to ROTP-CAM in January `09, and they didn't open my file until march. They are telling me that I need to get a high schhol transcript equivalency. That could not be possible, because if my transcripts were not equivalent with the Canadian standards, I could not have gotten into UWO. I'll be going back to Canada in may where I'll have my aptitude test. They still don't know if I should be doing an interview and the medical, because they say I would probably not get into the program this year.
I would really need some advice about what I should do now, because I can't afford the school on my own, and I have years of hard work in it.
Thank You in advance.

Offline Ditch

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2009, 10:11:00 »
Spending time out of Canada will not make your application go easily.  The UWO program is not a guarantee for all applicants - the CF will decide if you go there, or to RMC.

If the CF recruiting system is asking for high school equivalencies - go and get it.
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Offline George Wallace

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2009, 10:22:34 »
My question would be about th application deadlines. I contacted CFRC Toronto, but they kept confusing me with the RMC applicants. I have done high school in Hungary, but I am a Canadian citizen, and I applied to the UWO for CAMP and got accepted. I applied to ROTP-CAM in January `09, and they didn't open my file until march. They are telling me that I need to get a high schhol transcript equivalency. That could not be possible, because if my transcripts were not equivalent with the Canadian standards, I could not have gotten into UWO. I'll be going back to Canada in may where I'll have my aptitude test. They still don't know if I should be doing an interview and the medical, because they say I would probably not get into the program this year.
I would really need some advice about what I should do now, because I can't afford the school on my own, and I have years of hard work in it.
Thank You in advance.

What type of School did you attend in Hungary?  Was it an 'International School' for dependents of Foreign Service personnel?  I know that there are at least two types of these schools, one I believe run by the Americans and another by the French, who will be able to give you equivalencies.  It is something that you will have to investigate.  This is a matter that many children whose parents were on Foreign Service for a Government Dept have faced before, so if you are lucky, one such person may be on this site and come to your aid.
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Offline spagyi

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2009, 13:50:06 »
Thank You for posting. I attended a regular Hungarian high school, only at the end of each schoolyear did I go to Hungary to take exams. My parents are not foreign serving members, I just chose the Hungarian school for its higher level of education.
I would like to ask about the application deadline for ROTP-CAM, because I am confused about that date. I was told it is in January, but I have heard different versions, therefore I found it best to apply in January.
I have had some confusion in the CFRC regarding my application (they confused me with the RMC applicants).
Thank You for the post once again.

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #16 on: April 25, 2009, 15:02:16 »

I would like to ask about the application deadline for ROTP-CAM, because I am confused about that date. I was told it is in January, but I have heard different versions, therefore I found it best to apply in January.


Something much better answered by those in the University Registrar's Office than anyone here. If you applied in January, what are you worried about?
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Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #17 on: April 25, 2009, 18:42:05 »
. . . I have done high school in Hungary, but I am a Canadian citizen, and I applied to the UWO for CAMP and got accepted.  . . . .  They are telling me that I need to get a high schhol transcript equivalency. That could not be possible, because if my transcripts were not equivalent with the Canadian standards, I could not have gotten into UWO. I'll be going back to Canada in may where I'll have my aptitude test. They still don't know if I should be doing an interview and the medical, because they say I would probably not get into the program this year. . . .

As you stated that you are already accepted into UWO, I'm assuming that you attained a "Gimnázium Érettségi Bizonyítvány (Secondary School Leaving Certificate) since that is the admission requirement for an international student who was educated in Hungary as noted at International Admissions Requirements for CAMP.

While many Canadian universities which actively attract foreign students have adopted their own policies for school equivalencies, the Canadian Forces (like most other public or private employers) have not and when judging the educational background of potential members rely on outside "Credential Assessment and Qualification Recognition Services" such as those listed here (mid-way down the page).  It would be your responsibility to obtain such an assessment and equivalency for your Hungarian education as requested by the recruiting centre.

Just because UWO deems you meet the minimum requirements to enter their program doesn't mean that the CF has to accept you.  Their admission requirements are just that and only that - "admission requirements"; the CF's standards (evaluating much more than simply high school graduation) are higher.
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Offline spagyi

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #18 on: April 25, 2009, 19:15:50 »
Thank You for Your help, You have been very helpful. :salute:
« Last Edit: April 25, 2009, 19:20:13 by spagyi »

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #19 on: May 06, 2009, 23:01:58 »
An update for those interested in this program:


    UWO's CAM program has severed it's ties with Maylan Flight Academy for a variety of reasons. Some of you who have been keeping track of the situation will know some of the details and reasons, but what's important for new applicants to know is that we're now flying with Diamond Flight Centre London. We've just started but the equipment and facilities appear to be top notch.
   As always, anyone with questions pertaining to the new arrangement, or the program in general; feel free to PM me.
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Offline Magic

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #20 on: May 09, 2009, 01:54:45 »
This sounds like promising news for me since I will be attending the CAMP program this September. Any details on the fleet of aircraft which students will be flying for their PPL, CPL and multi ?

Offline Heff18

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #21 on: May 09, 2009, 08:13:40 »
Looks like pure Diamond's.

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #22 on: May 10, 2009, 16:09:56 »
This sounds like promising news for me since I will be attending the CAMP program this September. Any details on the fleet of aircraft which students will be flying for their PPL, CPL and multi ?


The majority of training will take place on a DA-20, and that hasn't changed. But we will be re-introducing some time on the DA-40 with the G1000 setup, and our twin time will be on DA-42 Twinstars (huzzah!), rather than Piper Seminoles.
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Offline Pat_Y

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #23 on: May 10, 2009, 16:45:11 »
I was in a 42 yesterday..... tons of fun. I was holding a 60 degree angle of bank turn with out no problem at all. ;D ;D

Offline Heff18

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #24 on: May 12, 2009, 14:52:34 »
Just found out I've been accepted into CAM, most likely into year 2. What a load of stress off my shoulders!

Now to get the official paperwork all cleared up. Anyone here going into year 2 in September?

On that note, to any CAM students... has anyone had or know someone who went in with their PPL? Do you go right onto CPL training or skip a year of flying and do CPL in third year?

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #25 on: May 12, 2009, 18:45:00 »

Now to get the official paperwork all cleared up. Anyone here going into year 2 in September?

 
  You could start introducing yourself to this group: http://www.facebook.com/home.php#/group.php?gid=30699667050&ref=ts



On that note, to any CAM students... has anyone had or know someone who went in with their PPL? Do you go right onto CPL training or skip a year of flying and do CPL in third year?

   Yes, I know a few people who had their PPL. I can't comment on how it will be NEXT year, because of the switch in flight schools, but these people were credited for their PPL pending a check ride with a CFI. They still had to attend Ground School and PGI's to meet the requirements of the ICPL. Unfortunately, they did not start a whole lot of CPL flying, they mostly flew just occasionally to stay current and build X-country hours. They weren't too happy about it, but it makes sense now because we're all even and can start our CPL together.


  Good luck!
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Offline Heff18

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #26 on: May 12, 2009, 21:42:39 »
Even though I'll be entering year 2, I have to pay both year 1 + year 2's flight costs, so I better be getting something for that money! (Hopefully the CF picks up the year 1 costs  :o). To this point I've only ever flown a 172 so I'm looking forward to trying out the Diamonds.

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #27 on: June 19, 2009, 13:10:16 »
Even though I'll be entering year 2, I have to pay both year 1 + year 2's flight costs, so I better be getting something for that money! (Hopefully the CF picks up the year 1 costs  :o). To this point I've only ever flown a 172 so I'm looking forward to trying out the Diamonds.

  Sorry this is so delayed...dereliction of duty on my part. Seeing as you don't fly in first year, they just spread the 3 years of flight costs across 4 years, so you're not getting hosed. And the CF will pick up your costs. The Diamonds have been real nice for me so far, hope to meet you next year.
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Offline grandpa

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #28 on: July 05, 2009, 12:24:44 »
Forgive me if I have done this incorrectly but after all I am a Granpa!
I am looking for some information to help me in my "cheerleading" role for my granddaughter.   She is interested in becoming a pilot just like her dear old grandpa wanted to be (bad eyes ruled out any aircrew in those days).
On the Forces.ca website I read " Regular Officer Training Plan – Pilots (CAMP) The Commercial Aviation Management Program (CAMP) at the University of Western Ontario is the only university aviation program sponsored by the Canadian Forces Regular Officers Training Plan".
Do they mean the only "civilian" university or is it that she can not attend RMC or CMR and still become a pilot.
I have a million other questions, as does she, but I will leave it at that for the time being seeing as I may be doing everything completley wrong on this forum anyway.

My thanks in advance for any help given

Offline SupersonicMax

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #29 on: July 05, 2009, 12:28:23 »
That's the only AVIATION university program sponsored by the CF.  RMC and other universities are good, but she won't have and aviation degree at the end.  But you don't need one to be a pilot.

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #30 on: July 05, 2009, 16:58:01 »
Forgive me if I have done this incorrectly but after all I am a Granpa!
I am looking for some information to help me in my "cheerleading" role for my granddaughter.   She is interested in becoming a pilot just like her dear old grandpa wanted to be (bad eyes ruled out any aircrew in those days).
On the Forces.ca website I read " Regular Officer Training Plan – Pilots (CAMP) The Commercial Aviation Management Program (CAMP) at the University of Western Ontario is the only university aviation program sponsored by the Canadian Forces Regular Officers Training Plan".
Do they mean the only "civilian" university or is it that she can not attend RMC or CMR and still become a pilot.
I have a million other questions, as does she, but I will leave it at that for the time being seeing as I may be doing everything completley wrong on this forum anyway.

My thanks in advance for any help given

The difference between the CAM program and any other ROTP CF program (in a civilian university) is that the flight training is included in the school years.  A CAM graduate will bypass Primary Flight Training as well.
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Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #31 on: July 08, 2009, 15:20:31 »
  A CAM graduate will bypass Primary Flight Training as well.

   And become irresistable to the opposite sex.
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Offline lornscotpter

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #32 on: September 14, 2009, 19:53:30 »
In regards to ROTP subsidisation, must you apply to the University of Western CAMP first before applying to the CF reg force for ROTP, or is it the other way around. As well I am in the reserve forces, would this make a differance to my application.

Offline George Wallace

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #33 on: September 14, 2009, 19:58:02 »
benny88  in Reply # 8  posted this information:

Quote
Commercial Aviation Management (CAM) Program Sponsorship for Pilots

What is ROTP?
ROTP is the Regular Officer Training Program offered by the Canadian Forces. It is a subsidized education plan for applicants to apply to any ordinary degree program at either RMC (Royal Military College) or at a recognized and pre-authorized civilian university.

What is CAM?
The Commercial Aviation Management (CAM) program at the University of Western Ontario is the only university aviation program sponsored by the Canadian Forces Regular Officers Training Plan (ROTP). CAM is a specialized ROTP module, subsidizing successful candidates for their university education and flight training. CAM is a highly competitive program in which only a few candidates are selected from across Canada.

Why CAM?
The CAM program will equip students with an extensive set of skills and prepare them for a career as a Pilot in the Canadian Forces.

Through the Bachelor of Management and Organizational Studies (BMOS), applicants will gain the capacity for critical thinking, an ability to adapt to change, and strong problem-solving and communication skills. At the same time, they will have the opportunity to study advanced aviation topics, accounting, finance, marketing, and operations management as well as liberal arts courses in the Faculty of Social Science. The result is a unique education experience that is ideal preparation for employment as a Pilot and Officer in the Canadian Forces.

Students will graduate with a four-year Bachelor of Management and Organizational Studies Degree.

Graduates of the Commercial Aviation Management Program will be sponsored by the Chief of the Air Staff (CAS) to take the flight training operation and will be licensed to fly commercial aircraft. Those completing the flight option in years 2, 3 and 4 of the BMOS program receive more than 400 hours of integrated ground school instruction and 260 hours of flight and simulator time, and earn the following:

- Private Pilot Licence
- Commercial Pilot Licence
- Multi-Engine Rating
- Group 1 Instrument Rating

Flight training in years 2, 3, and 4 operates from September until June, and is conducted in accordance with the new Transport Canada Integrated Commercial Pilot Licence program.

Who qualifies?
The applicant must meet all requirements for ROTP pilots and be enrolled in the Bachelor of Management and Organizational Studies with the specialization of Commercial Aviation Management at the University of Western Ontario. No alternative aviation programs are permitted. (ie. RMC, Seneca, Waterloo etc…)


Key differences between the ROTP and the CAM application process

ROTP Process
When an applicant applies for the pilot occupation with ROTP they are processed for Air Operations rather than the specific trade of Pilot.
Step 1:
Applicant must complete an initial interview, medical and aptitude test at their respective recruiting centre
Step 2:
Applicant must pass the aircrew selection held in Trenton, Ontario
Step 3:
Applicant must achieve a military medical Air Factor of 1 at the Defence Research and Development Centre (DRDC) in Toronto
Step 4:
Applicant must successfully compete their first year at their respective university

NOTE: Depending on the applicant’s performance in their first year, they may or may not qualify for the pilot occupation. Their prior admission into Air Operations may include occupations as Pilot, Navigator or Aerospace Control
   
CAM ROTP Process
When an applicant applies for the pilot occupation with CAM they are processed specifically as a Pilot rather than Air Operations.

Identical Steps 1 through 3 applies to CAM, Step 4 is what sets the CAM and the ROTP selection process apart.

Step 4:
If successful the applicant will be 1 out of a few applicants across Canada to be admitted into CAM where they are enrolled as pilots and not in Air Operations.

NOTE: if successful, they are now guaranteed their first choice of occupation (Pilot).

Benefits
Candidates of ROTP CAM will receive their education in the BMOS CAM program at the University of Western Ontario completely subsidized. This amounts to approximately $5000 a year, totalling approximately $20,000 over the four year degree. Candidates will receive flight training subsidized by the Chief of the Air Staff (CAS), which amounts to approximately $15,000 a year, totalling approximately $60,000 over the four years. Mandatory books and supplies are also subsidized for the candidates. Candidates will also receive an annual salary of approximately $17,000 a year totally approximately $70,000 over the four years as an officer cadet. The time spent at the university as an Officer Cadet is pensionable and additional benefits include complete Canadian Forces health/dental care and 4 weeks leave.





Career Path
During the candidate’s first summer as an Officer Cadet, they will complete Basic Military Officer Qualifications (BMOQ). This must be completed prior to the onset of their second year of study. The following summers, the Officer Cadet will receive employment or on-the-job-training.

At the successful completion of the BMOS Commercial Aviation Management degree, the Officer Cadet will be sent directly to Basic Flight Training in Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan, bypassing the Primary Flight training stage in Portage la Prairie, Manitoba that all other ROTP pilots must attend. After receiving their wings, pilots will be assigned to a squadron to continue their career as a pilot in the Canadian Forces.

NOTE: Candidates must complete a minimum obligatory period of eight years following their graduation before they are allowed release from the Canadian Forces.

Points to note:
Once at the University of Western Ontario they must remember they are no longer students but rather Officer Cadets for the Canadian Forces hence they must conduct themselves in an orderly manner that respects the Canadian Forces. They are not permitted to accept other employment as their tuition is subsidized and they earn a salary.

Quick Facts
•   CAM is specialized ROTP module
•   Only 6 applications for CAM were accepted nationwide for processing in 2008.
•   Total Value of scholarship = $150,000
o   $80,000/4years for tuition, flying, books/supplies
o   $70,000/4 years of earned salary
•   CAM applicants are guaranteed Pilot occupation
•   By-pass primary flight training
•   Great way to pay for university and flight training and build aviation experience
•   Time spent at the University of Western Ontario as an Officer Cadet is pensionable time
•   CF health/dental care
DISCLAIMER: The opinions and arguments of George Wallace posted on this Site are solely those of George Wallace and not the opinion of Army.ca and are posted for information purposes only.
Unless so stated, they are reflective of my opinion -- and my opinion only, a right that I enjoy along with every other Canadian citizen.

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #34 on: October 23, 2009, 16:07:41 »
New course website at flyuwo.com

The site is still in the works, and there's nothing too new on there, it's just up-to-date and more concise. As always, post or PM me if you want to know more about the program.


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Offline dsw92

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #35 on: October 30, 2009, 01:20:21 »
Does anybody know the availability of ROTP through the Science and Aviation program at University of Waterloo? It is a University Degree program, but I haven't found any information on it in the forum.

Offline aviator22

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #36 on: November 01, 2009, 20:11:02 »
i'm in science and aviation at UW, 2nd year.  ROTP isn't offered the same way as it is for the CAM program.  as far as i know, we don't have anyone in ROTP, although I know a few people who are applying, although due to a backlog in pilot training i've heard very few people are being accepted. PM me if you have any questions

Offline Heff18

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #37 on: November 02, 2009, 11:12:39 »
If you were to be accepted for ROTP, they would subsidize your tuition and related fees, but not the flight training. UWO's CAM is the only fully subsidized flight degree.

Offline dsw92

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #38 on: November 02, 2009, 16:38:32 »
THANK YOU.
That one reply was the biggest help!

Offline curious22

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #39 on: November 03, 2009, 10:57:13 »
New to this site, but am going through ROTP process right now and plan on going to UWO CAM 1st year in Sept 2010. Was told by recruiter that ROTP only covers the undergraduate degree and that the Air Force will no longer cover any related flight costs.
 Anybody else hear this.. Also was told need high 80's percent U level courses to get into CAM>

Offline Heff18

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #40 on: November 03, 2009, 12:50:19 »
I've heard conflicting reports, but having just talked to recruiter, it appears flight costs are no longer covered.

Offline curious22

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #41 on: November 03, 2009, 13:14:53 »
Also heard that intake of pilots will be low or none this year because of backlog of training of existing pilots. Does anyone think that there will a lot less or no ROTP candidates from UWO CAMP? I plan on defintely going to UWO and am working on the marks to get there so maybe I will have to stay in the civie world.

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #42 on: February 08, 2010, 21:22:49 »
Hey everyone, sorry to have been AWOL from my own thread.

    AFAIK, flight training is still covered. I know mine for sure will be until the end of my program. I spoke to my SEM (Subsidized Education Manager, a Captain who is in charge of all ROTP members and activities in a geographic area)  because I heard those same rumblings and had a friend who was interested in the program. My SEM said that there were no plans to stop offering subsidization for the flight training at this time, but that it was being reviewed because of delays of members getting to postings because of flight training.
     I should catch wind of it fairly early on if something changes, in which case I'll post it, but I recommend continuing with the application. You could also try contacting the CFRC here in London, because I know they're the most knowledgable about the program.

  Good luck
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Offline Heff18

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #43 on: February 10, 2010, 23:17:39 »
I have talked and confirmed with both the SEM and CFRC London that all new CAM applicants will no longer be funded for their flight training. Tuition and books will all be covered as per usual ROTP, but if the flight option is chosen, the costs will have to be covered by the applicant.

The CAM program is currently under going some modification to help diversify the specialization from it's heavy finance focus by offering courses in the human resource management option and opening up the overall course offerings to mix and match with a variety of management & organizational courses in later years.

Nearing the end of my first year, I look forward to what the next few years will bring and can't wait to get back up in the skies next year.

Good luck to all CAM applicants, and hopefully see you next year!

Offline Ditch

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #44 on: February 28, 2010, 00:39:02 »
CAM was a one-off project by AF-FG to help offset some training backlogs.  While ROTP covered the costs associated with tuition, books, etc.  The Air Force budget covered the cost of the actual flight training.  With current fiscal constraints and the system slowing pulling itself out of the quagmire, the benefits of this course to the AF is not tangible.  In the end - it saved the pilot candidate one course.  Now it's back to PFT in Portage for everyone.
Per Ardua Ad Astra

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #45 on: March 04, 2010, 21:21:19 »
the benefits of this course to the AF is not tangible.  In the end - it saved the pilot candidate one course.

I would like to see statistics for how many CAM grads are successful in BFT and AFT/OTUs versus those with just PFT, but I think you'd be proven right in that the difference would be negligible. I'm glad I entered the program, but that's mostly just because I love to fly, not because I think it will give me an edge as a military pilot.
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Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #46 on: March 11, 2010, 21:52:38 »
Heff or anyone else;

Any recent news on this out of the Recruiting Group? The University is having a Fall Preview day and they've asked me to come talk to potential applicants about the CAM program. I plan to go anyways because I can still help civilian applicants, but I'd like to have the most up-to-date info regarding ROTP. Let me know ASAP!


Cheers
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Offline Heff18

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #47 on: March 12, 2010, 13:41:12 »
The word is still the same. Applicants can attend the CAM program via ROTP, but flight will not be subsidized. I laughed when the recruiter said applicants can either wait years to get their PFT then BFT slot or pay for a PFT bypass and wait slightly less than years for their BFT slot.


Offline Otis

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #48 on: March 19, 2010, 14:46:50 »
Actually ... we were told yesterday that the CAM program is no longer eligible for ROTP ... just like the program at Seneca (though the Seneca program still erroneously advertises on it's website that it is)

Personnel already IN the CAM program under ROTP will continue until completion ... no new applicants will be considered.

Welcome to the CF .. max flex!
Since I've been on the new medication, it's become MUCH easier to ignore the Stupid people.

Offline ocanadaperfect

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #49 on: March 23, 2010, 00:28:59 »
Hi,
Anyone knows how competitive it is if i want to get into the groundside instead of being a pilot and flying a plane etc.?
Because i want to be a air traffic controller instead, actually, i'm not even sure if that's what the groundside's for, the western's website didn't give me enough info
Any help will be greatly appreciated
Thanks

Offline Heff18

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #50 on: March 23, 2010, 11:40:05 »
Generally, the only difference between airside and groundside is that the airside takes ground school and does flight training on top of the regular courses taken. That and tuition is a lot cheaper for groundside  8). Both will graduate with a degree featuring the CAM designation (there are multiple paths to achieve this, both for air and ground).

As for competitiveness, I'm not sure if there is any difference between the two. My impression of my class is there are either equal or more groundside students enrolled in it than air.

Offline TimBit

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #51 on: March 23, 2010, 14:23:23 »
   And become irresistable to the opposite sex.

Ah! Until the opposite sex realizes you want to fly jets and then tells you "forget it honey Cold Lake ain't for me". Then you'll be irresistible...to yourself?

Sorry, couldn't resist...

Offline benny88

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #52 on: March 25, 2010, 10:04:05 »
Ah! Until the opposite sex realizes you want to fly jets and then tells you "forget it honey Cold Lake ain't for me". Then you'll be irresistible...to yourself?

Sorry, couldn't resist...

Haha as I get closer and closer to graduation, my girlfriend begins to show more and more interest in my posting preferences...wonder why that is?
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Offline Dimsum

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #53 on: April 04, 2010, 17:48:32 »
Haha as I get closer and closer to graduation, my girlfriend begins to show more and more interest in my posting preferences...wonder why that is?

I'll save you the trouble.  Just put down Victoria or Comox.  That's it.   ;D
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."

Offline Lockwire

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Re: Commercial Aviation Management program for pilots at UWO
« Reply #54 on: June 14, 2018, 16:40:18 »
I would like to resurrect this topic and see if anyone went through it recently.

Considering UTP NCM application into it, and pay for the flight portion myself since I will retain my salary as a Spec 1 AVN... any ideas?
I posted in the Seneca thread about CEOTP since there is intake now.

Too bad that CF shied away from CAMP, it appears that all candidates are pretty sharp coming out of there.