Author Topic: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)  (Read 911089 times)

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Offline Chief Engineer

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1875 on: February 21, 2018, 18:06:41 »
Chief,

If you are referring to the aforementioned quotes I would tend to disagree.  The Asterix CAN do all of those things, but WILL it ?  That is another matter.  My pickup can haul over 13000lbs, but it never will as I wouldn't dream of straining the engine, drive train and breaking systems to the max on my 60K truck.  It can do over 200 KMH but it never will, so long as I drive it.

I haven't head any negative statements/rumblings yet about the ship.  You could PM me if you would like. 

Having said that I am in full support another tanker from Davie.  But as long as this government is in power it will never happen.

I have in the past said an additional IAOR in conjunction with two JSS or whatever they're calling them now would compliment each other. Actually being on board i'm not sure about that now. People have said that its a political thing we are not optioning a second ship however I wonder now if there is other considerations in play.
"When your draught exceeds your depth, you are most assuredly aground"

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Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1876 on: February 21, 2018, 21:28:57 »
Its not supposed to go into war zones.  And was never promoted as a fighting vessel.  It is not commissioned into the RCN.  This isn't news.  Its a move to stir up unfounded and ill informed negative sentiment.

It's a Victoria newspaper that likes to drum up a lot of Letters to the Editor from retired navy guys... :)
"The most important qualification of a soldier is fortitude under fatigue and privation. Courage is only second; hardship, poverty and want are the best school for a soldier." Napoleon

Offline Furniture

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1877 on: February 21, 2018, 22:26:37 »
Asterix is leaps and bounds above what until recently we were operating as "warship" tankers...

The government is short sighted and typically Canadian in not accepting a second Resolve ship because we have better '90s vintage tankers on order for delivery in the next 10 or so years baring any further delays.

Davie may be over stating the capabilities of the Asterix, but Seaspan hasn't even cut steel on the new AORs. It comes down to whether "good enough" is what we can work with, or if we take the Canadian route of over-engineering and studying things until we take 20 years to decide we can't make a better boot, ruck, ship than industry, but it buys votes so we will...

Offline Colin P

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1878 on: February 22, 2018, 12:11:40 »
Other than the Resolve are there any other AOR designs in the West that are newer and significantly different than the Berlins? Even the Brits were planning 5 different classes of ships to do what we plan on one.

Offline Navy_Pete

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1879 on: February 22, 2018, 12:45:53 »
Does the Asterix have a cargo elevator or something similar?  Having an oiler is fantastic, but I'm under the impression that it con't (or won't) carry the big ammunition, but if it has an elevator to the store rooms at least they can carry spare parts, relief supplies etc.

Offline AlexanderM

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1880 on: February 22, 2018, 12:47:07 »
Other than the Resolve are there any other AOR designs in the West that are newer and significantly different than the Berlins? Even the Brits were planning 5 different classes of ships to do what we plan on one.
Are you talking designs or ships that have been built? If designs you can see here that there is an AOR version, which I imagine could be ordered in different sizes.

http://www.bmtdsl.co.uk/bmt-design-portfolio/auxiliaries/bmt-aegir-logistic-support-vessels/

Offline Colin P

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1881 on: February 22, 2018, 13:58:42 »
Looks like a mix of the Berlin and Resolve. The good news is that things we like in the Resolve can be added to the Berlins and make sure they don't add things we don't like.

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1882 on: February 22, 2018, 15:44:25 »
People have said that its a political thing we are not optioning a second ship however I wonder now if there is other considerations in play.

If you are able Chief Stoker can you elaborate?

Offline Chief Engineer

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1883 on: February 22, 2018, 16:22:30 »
If you are able Chief Stoker can you elaborate?

Not really but one has only to look at the dozens of contractor trucks on NB jetty to form a picture.
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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1884 on: February 22, 2018, 17:22:22 »
Not really but one has only to look at the dozens of contractor trucks on NB jetty to form a picture.

Ah.  The new baby may be teething...

Offline Furniture

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1885 on: February 22, 2018, 17:53:11 »
I imagine FMF is very upset that they aren't getting the OT to work on her... and of course not getting the free coffee and soup while hanging out in the mess for coffee breaks.

Offline Chief Engineer

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1886 on: February 22, 2018, 19:01:34 »
Ah.  The new baby may be teething...

A little more than that. There was a reason why she was sent down to Halifax during Christmas before the new year.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2018, 19:16:27 by Chief Stoker »
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Offline CloudCover

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1887 on: February 23, 2018, 08:17:20 »
This article suggests the ship is is receiving a weapons fit and sensors, and is based on supposed comments from the Commodore : https://www.canadianmanufacturing.com/manufacturing/canadian-navys-new-resupply-vessel-one-major-problem-208488/
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Offline Chief Engineer

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1888 on: February 23, 2018, 08:35:35 »
This article suggests the ship is is receiving a weapons fit and sensors, and is based on supposed comments from the Commodore : https://www.canadianmanufacturing.com/manufacturing/canadian-navys-new-resupply-vessel-one-major-problem-208488/

They are installing radars but no CWIS as of now. The weapons they are talking about are probably .50 Cal mounts.
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Offline CloudCover

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1889 on: February 23, 2018, 10:23:30 »
There is nothing the new contract with RCL that would provide for a CIWS for Resolve/Asterix anyway.

In photo's I have been watching the ship carefully. If there is ever any intent to use this ship other than a civilian chartered supply ship, it seems to me they would need to fit a secure ops room in the space, a decent radar fit, maybe some EW gear, soft kill and decoy launchers would be nice to see.  (I'm not sure even the JSS/Berlin will have much of that once they hit the water sometime in the next 200 years.)     
edit: and if they go with that sort of equipment fit, the RCN may as well just buy the thing.
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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1890 on: February 23, 2018, 10:31:00 »
When I had a visit aboard RFA Wave Ruler in Martinique, I was shown the 30mm Goal Keeper on each wing as well as Dillons on each Bridge Wing.  I was told, IIRC,  that the civilian crew were trained on how to operate/maintain the gear for those times that there were no military personnel embarked.

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1891 on: February 23, 2018, 10:37:22 »
There is nothing the new contract with RCL that would provide for a CIWS for Resolve/Asterix anyway.

In photo's I have been watching the ship carefully. If there is ever any intent to use this ship other than a civilian chartered supply ship, it seems to me they would need to fit a secure ops room in the space, a decent radar fit, maybe some EW gear, soft kill and decoy launchers would be nice to see.  (I'm not sure even the JSS/Berlin will have much of that once they hit the water sometime in the next 200 years.)     
edit: and if they go with that sort of equipment fit, the RCN may as well just buy the thing.

Interesting, do you think Davie went ahead and put in the areas for a CWIS anyways so they could proclaim that it has the capability to make it look more desirable?
"When your draught exceeds your depth, you are most assuredly aground"

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Offline CloudCover

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1892 on: February 23, 2018, 13:36:25 »
Could probably bolt one onto an Orca if there was desire and room. But self defence as you know is much more than guns. It implies detecting and analyzing a threat*,  and among other things not shooting up the ship beside you. So while I don't believe Davie is throwing the weapons fit as mere concepts, but more is required for it to be an effective concept in a "navy sort of way."
* even though CIWS is a self contained system.
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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1893 on: February 23, 2018, 14:09:56 »
This article suggests the ship is is receiving a weapons fit and sensors, and is based on supposed comments from the Commodore : https://www.canadianmanufacturing.com/manufacturing/canadian-navys-new-resupply-vessel-one-major-problem-208488/

Speaking to the rumour mill, apparently the Asterix may not have been "finished on time" despite Davie's best sales pitch.  (Rumours, not facts... just watercooler talk here).

Stories about missing plumbing, large numbers of leaks and issues with some of the RAS equipment are starting to percolate.  I expect some of this is teething problems as is common in refits.  Some may be due to rushing the ship out the door to meet a timeline for their sales pitch.  Essentially, she might still be under construction...

Offline dapaterson

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1894 on: February 23, 2018, 14:16:52 »
Speaking to the rumour mill, apparently the Asterix may not have been "finished on time" despite Davie's best sales pitch.  (Rumours, not facts... just watercooler talk here).

Stories about missing plumbing, large numbers of leaks and issues with some of the RAS equipment are starting to percolate.  I expect some of this is teething problems as is common in refits.  Some may be due to rushing the ship out the door to meet a timeline for their sales pitch.  Essentially, she might still be under construction...

Sounds positively Irving-esque...
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Offline CloudCover

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1895 on: February 23, 2018, 14:32:39 »
Yikes. Hopefully the plug is in the drain hole.
 
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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1896 on: February 23, 2018, 14:37:20 »
Yikes. Hopefully the plug is in the drain hole.

Just want to re-emphasize this is rumour.  Don't need Davie coming for me in court...

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1897 on: February 23, 2018, 18:20:36 »
True 'dat. Non disclosure agreements are in place.
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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1898 on: February 24, 2018, 15:06:36 »
More Asterix info.  She may not be ready/able to go to RIMPAC this summer.  Lots of work to be done.

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Re: AOR Replacement & the Joint Support Ship (Merged Threads)
« Reply #1899 on: February 24, 2018, 20:57:34 »
FFS has a contract to perform. Davie better not be giving the Libs an opportunity to terminate for breach.
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