Author Topic: MARTECH implementation issues  (Read 1692 times)

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Offline Cwes

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MARTECH implementation issues
« on: November 05, 2017, 01:08:28 »
I am an ex Patricia, reapplying to the Navy.

I am applying to WENG tech and MARTECH. WENG tech looks like a solid choice, but of course MARTECH is having internal issues and recruiters are looking to fill the positions.

Both appeal, but, I have heard not the kindest of things with regards to how MARTECH is being run and how guys are not becoming proficient in the trade because of the wide range of training. I would like to avoid a grind, as much as possible. (We all know how nightmarish the military can become under poor leadership or capability.)

I want some more information; Good, bad and ugly. Anyone with info or advice is greatly appreciated.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2017, 12:34:49 by Cwes »

Offline NavyShooter

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2017, 18:16:37 »
I'm a W Eng CPO2, our trade has not been without issues as well, but when we rolled into our new trade organization 6 years ago, we had QSPs, lesson plans, etc all done in advance. We're re-evaluating right now to see what has, and what hasn't worked. We're busy fixing some of that right now.

The MARTECH world is moving forward with their trade change-over, and, like the W Eng world, they're facing some issues when we did it. 

We're 6 years, and many lessons down the road.  Hopefully the MARTECH world is learning from our errors along the way.

I hope that helps a bit.

NS
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Offline jollyjacktar

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #2 on: November 05, 2017, 18:45:25 »
I used to be a keen recruiter for my old trade, HT.  That stopped with the amalgamation.  I cannot, will not reccomend coming into the MARTECH trade, nor do any of my fellow legacy co-workers that l know.  Even the CPO1 who was part of the group who facilitated the change said he cannot sing its virtues.  Yes, I'll freely admit I'm bitter but so is everyone l know with maybe 1 or 2 exceptions.  My  :2c:
I'm just like the CAF, I seem to have retention issues.

Offline Underway

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #3 on: November 05, 2017, 19:28:07 »
The first MARTECH course is going through NFS(A) right now.  But there doesn't seem to be anything higher than initial trades training right now.  Which is an issue for those who are currently in MARTECH but at QL5 or higher.  However if you were to switch you would be coming into the trade at the ground level.  One would like to think that by the time you get switched and started some of these issues would sort themselves out.  Promotion past LS could be a problem for a while however if problems similar to the "WENG Tech legacy trade" issues surface.

Offline Grimey

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2017, 19:31:25 »
I'm an ex CPO2 Mar Eng and have been out for 5 years this month.  I have friends and peers who have contributed significant blood and sweat over the past few years in getting the MARTECH program off the ground and who obviously have a vested interest in its successful launch.

I hope (and wish) that issues with the WENG implementation were taken into account.  I'd be flabbergasted if they weren't.

My personal view on this is as follows: this amalgamation should have taken place, or at least actively considered, around 25 years ago at around the same time the first frigate was commissioned.  Instead, the branch took its steamer manning mentality and transferred it, with little change, to the CPFs.  From my perspective at the time, it seemed blatantly obvious that the future of the Mar Eng branch was diesel electric, so why not get ahead of the curve and start organizing the branch around it?

For Jollyjacktar, I can appreciate your concerns.  I can only hope that the best attributes of the 3 constituent trades ( I guess 4 if you include MESOs) are enough to make it work.

Offline kratz

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #5 on: November 05, 2017, 20:23:41 »
I'm an ex CPO2 Mar Eng<snip>

 ( I guess 4 if you include MESOs) are enough to make it work.

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Offline Grimey

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #6 on: November 05, 2017, 21:12:50 »
It's still one navy.  :remembrance:

True enough.....and substantially more integrated than when I left.

Offline jollyjacktar

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #7 on: November 05, 2017, 21:57:04 »
For Jollyjacktar, I can appreciate your concerns.  I can only hope that the best attributes of the 3 constituent trades ( I guess 4 if you include MESOs) are enough to make it work.

I am of the understanding the RN are walking back from their almagamation as they found it wasn't satisfactory.  They're not going back 100% as that would embarrass certain parties but as far as they can.

Promotions are frozen for now which won't win hearts and minds.  Releases are continuing at 3x the normal levels from some of the legacy trades.  One of my former MS remustered to Bosn and just recently finished his QL3, he's happy and that has been noted by a number of the kids. 
I'm just like the CAF, I seem to have retention issues.

Offline Grimey

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #8 on: November 06, 2017, 00:29:38 »
I am of the understanding the RN are walking back from their almagamation as they found it wasn't satisfactory.  They're not going back 100% as that would embarrass certain parties but as far as they can.

Promotions are frozen for now which won't win hearts and minds.  Releases are continuing at 3x the normal levels from some of the legacy trades.  One of my former MS remustered to Bosn and just recently finished his QL3, he's happy and that has been noted by a number of the kids.

Not sure about the extent of RN amalgamation compared to 15 odd years ago (as observed on a somewhat lubricated one day XPOL on HMS YORK during APOLLO.). Back then they still had artificers and mechanics and could do a whole career as either.  Their electricians were the same, just had an (L) as a suffix to MEM or MEA. 
Not sure about their HT/shipwright equivalent, or even if they had such a beast.  The mechs may have been doing the HT type stuff.

What was interesting was that plant watchkeeping wasn't trade specific.  They had troad POs standing EOOW watches.  Always wondered why we didn't take the MCC and Duty Tech packages to the next logical step and have the entire department certified. 

Offline NavyShooter

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2017, 19:52:45 »
Quote
Always wondered why we didn't take the MCC and Duty Tech packages to the next logical step and have the entire department certified. 

Because then CSE guys like me would be fit into the rotation as well? 

That might be TOO integrated....

 ;D
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Offline jollyjacktar

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2017, 20:23:39 »
Wait for it.  I hear you bitches are going to be jammed into the fold too down the line.
I'm just like the CAF, I seem to have retention issues.

Offline Grimey

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #11 on: November 06, 2017, 21:21:45 »
Wait for it.  I hear you bitches are going to be jammed into the fold too down the line.

I heard the other day that everyone is 1 in 2 now anyways, so why not?😀

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2017, 08:53:05 »
Slowly moving into "Star-Trek" era: All engineers are just "engineers" and wear the same colour shirt.


Oh! Wait: We all wear the same colour shirt already!  ;D

Offline NavyShooter

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #13 on: November 07, 2017, 12:10:11 »
Jolly, shoot me a note on the DWAN and I'll flip you a copy of a manning proposal I wrote up a while back.

You might be surprised at what I think....
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Offline jollyjacktar

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #14 on: November 07, 2017, 12:18:19 »
I will when I'm back in the office on Thursday.
I'm just like the CAF, I seem to have retention issues.

Offline EADAM

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next NETP training
« Reply #15 on: December 09, 2017, 15:55:14 »
Hi guys, do you know when  next NETP training thanks so much.

Offline NavyShooter

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #16 on: December 09, 2017, 20:39:41 »
You should be able to look at the schedule through the Campus Atlantic Website on the DWAN.  I might have the link at work that I can look up on Monday.

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Offline hicks22

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #17 on: Yesterday at 17:17:19 »
5 trades if you count the Fire fighters.  :nod:
If you're on the ground level of Mar Tech it might be a decent go. It's business as usual for the stokers. The kiwi mar techs that have come over worked almost exclusively with the stokers.
HT's below a PO2 are trying to be cert 2 hull tech fire fighters and most of them are getting out. Or happier as a bosn.
On a new platform it will make sense. On a CPF not really.
I'd say go WENG if you can

Offline Chief Stoker

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #18 on: Yesterday at 17:40:20 »
5 trades if you count the Fire fighters.  :nod:
If you're on the ground level of Mar Tech it might be a decent go. It's business as usual for the stokers. The kiwi mar techs that have come over worked almost exclusively with the stokers.
HT's below a PO2 are trying to be cert 2 hull tech fire fighters and most of them are getting out. Or happier as a bosn.
On a new platform it will make sense. On a CPF not really.
I'd say go WENG if you can

The people who embrace it will do well, the people who are leaving because of it that's their choice.
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Offline hicks22

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #19 on: Yesterday at 17:49:50 »
The people who embrace it will do well, the people who are leaving because of it that's their choice.

Agreed but lots of good people and skills lost in the process that could have been avoided with some forsight and better planning/ leadership.

Offline jollyjacktar

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #20 on: Yesterday at 18:17:20 »
The people who embrace it will do well, the people who are leaving because of it that's their choice.

Not really.  This was forced upon us all, we were given no choice.  I have only run across 1 maybe 2 guys who are embracing it.  The corporate knowledge and potential that is leaving because of this is going to be a Pyrrhic victory for the Kraken.
I'm just like the CAF, I seem to have retention issues.

Offline dapaterson

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #21 on: Yesterday at 18:30:57 »
Not really.  This was forced upon us all, we were given no choice.  I have only run across 1 maybe 2 guys who are embracing it.  The corporate knowledge and potential that is leaving because of this is going to be a Pyrrhic victory for the Kraken.

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Offline hicks22

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #22 on: Yesterday at 18:35:24 »
Most of the stokers are fine with it.. I mean nothing’s changed for them. They might get landed for a helo crash course or to learn welding. Nothing to be upset about.
You’ve got a MS HT whose now section base 3 IC the senior fire fighter, hull shop master and reports to OD stoker on his off time  :rofl: i’d want to be a bosn too.

Offline hicks22

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #23 on: Yesterday at 18:54:06 »
Imagine working towards a job where you’re guaranteed to make less than the guy before you. You’re a flyco qualified Cert3 6A HT making spec 1. Unreal.  :facepalm:

Offline Chief Stoker

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Re: MARTECH implementation issues
« Reply #24 on: Yesterday at 18:59:53 »
Not really.  This was forced upon us all, we were given no choice.  I have only run across 1 maybe 2 guys who are embracing it.  The corporate knowledge and potential that is leaving because of this is going to be a Pyrrhic victory for the Kraken.

I didn't agree either but what choice do I have. At least for me on the RES side of things is used to sailing for the last 20 years without a Hull Tech or EO.  In 10 years time no one will care and i'll be long retired (I hope)
"When your draught exceeds your depth, you are most assuredly aground"

All opinions stated are not official policy of the CF and of a private individual

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